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you're locked into Inception Radio

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Network superior Wisconsin

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you're tuned in tonight vision radio

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exposing the truth one secret at a time

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prepare yourself as we explore the

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shadow worlds of suppressed history

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secret knowledge forbidden religion and

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shine a light on the conspiracies to

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[Music]

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welcome to night-vision radio

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hey everybody welcome to night vision

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radio as you just heard I'm your host

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Renee Barnett glad you could join us

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tonight it's going to be an interesting

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very very interesting night really

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excited about tonight's guest tonight I

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have with me author and screenwriter

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Marie D Jones and we're going to be

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walking through the dark world of mind

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control and not just what you may be

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familiar with you've heard about the

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government mind control programs MKULTRA

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all those things yes absolutely we're

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going to go there but also how

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mind-control has sort of been practiced

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through the ages how we've sort of been

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programmed but Marie's not going to

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leave us hanging because she's going to

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redeem us a little bit later in the show

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with her book on archetypes or the

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information that she covered in her book

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on archetypes and how we can use those

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symbols those sort of collective symbols

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of universal consciousness to help to

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reprogram ourselves first to deprogram

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ourselves from outside programming

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that's been thrown at us not only

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throughout our lives but our ancestors

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lives but how to get out of that but

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then I gotta warn you because we might

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drop you back in it toward the end of

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the show because Marie's got a new book

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that's coming out I think it's gonna be

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out in a couple months but she's going

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to tell us all about that but that is

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going to be on demons that's a whole

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different ballgame and we're gonna find

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out what that's all about but before we

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get any further down the line let's

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introduce Marie hey Marie thanks for

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joining me tonight hello there how are

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ya oh I'm good I'm good I thought the

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demons might have gotten into the Skype

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tonight when we started and I'm

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flummoxed because I used it earlier and

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it's like what it down saying won't

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connect you need to update your account

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it's always updated oh I don't know I'll

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figure it out of course you know I 15

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minutes before showtime I'm like what oh

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yeah the joys of live radio live

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broadcasting period you know done live

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TV - and it's similar crazy experience

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but anyhow you know thinking about

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tonight's show over the last you know

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couple weeks or so since we first

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chatted online

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I was looking you know into your work

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and in mind control and you know it does

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sort of conjure up images of you know

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the military and you know acronyms like

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MK ULTRA and things like that but it's

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much much more than that isn't it well

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it is and I think you know most people

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watch movies and TV spy TV shows and

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conspiracy stories and that those are

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the images that they get and rightfully

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so because we do have a history our

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government does have a history of

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experimenting with different forms of

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mind-control and has for a long time and

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I'm sure still is but the thing is is

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this is something that is going on day

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to day in ways that we're not even

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thinking about or we may not even

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realize especially when it comes to

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things like media manipulation and what

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goes on with the news that we watch and

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the news that gets passed around now

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even on social networking that we take

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for for facts and we very rarely

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research on our own and that we don't

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understand is sponsored it's fun it's

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paid for it's bought and sold by

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corporations that have specific agendas

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and that is not a conspiracy that is

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something that has been going on for

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quite a while and it's a fact and the

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more you become aware of it the more you

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see it and once you see it you can't

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unsee it and and they think that that's

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really good because it means that once

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you wake up it's kind of hard to go back

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to sleep and it's like oh wow okay okay

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kind of swings both ways

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it depending on whose agenda may be

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being served at the moment you know

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because I think that people you know

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have sort of become distrustful you know

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a the media in you know or at least a

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faction of the population has become

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distrustful of media and especially

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cable news that sort of thing and so

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they tend to gravitate more toward you

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know social media and online and more

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independent or what they feel might be

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more independent programming but I mean

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I'm here to tell you that the of these

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people that seem independent on the

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Internet they're also being backed by

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someone or they're just pushing their

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own agenda so you're absolutely right we

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we don't have a tendency to research if

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we see something that sort of rings true

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to us we just grab it and we run with it

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and I've seen it a lot and I actually

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fell for something this week on Facebook

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I got some kind of a message that

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someone was trying to friend everyone

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don't friend this pose it's a virus and

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blah blah blah well I was really busy at

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the moment and normally I google that

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stuff and I make sure is that a hoax

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because usually it's already outed by

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somebody well yes time I was like super

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busy and I thought I'll just go ahead

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and shoot this off to fall because if

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it's true then in one instant you know

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they could be you know infected with

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this virus so I said you know I'm people

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like like you know I don't care how busy

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I am I'm gonna stop I looked at it yeah

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it was a hoax so I had to go yeah yeah

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I'm sorry everyone I didn't do my due

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diligence and I think that's what you're

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talking about we need to do our due

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diligence well even on social networking

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I would say the vast majority of what

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gets passed around his knees his opinion

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it's been it's propaganda if somebody's

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take on something that

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is molded to look like the news story

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those are really really insidious there

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there are things that go around that

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look like actual news headlines they

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look like you know they're they're

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legitimate and authentic even when you

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quick and read them it might take a

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while before you realize this is not a

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real website this is not you know the

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real news website or this is a parody or

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this is just you know somebody's blog

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that is created to look like some kind

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of official news service and you know

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nowadays I think the idea is to overload

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us with information coming at us from

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all directions and to kind of shake up

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our faith in our ability to discern

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truth from BS and truth from opinion

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what passes for news today the vast

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majority majority of it is opinion and I

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don't know when that line between

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opinion in fact blurred as crazy as it

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has been lately but and I think most of

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us are too busy too tired too distracted

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with our own lives to really stop and

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say what's being done to me how am I

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being manipulated here and do I care you

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know and sometimes we're so tired and

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lazy you know you said you pass

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something along without checking because

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you think what this came from my friend

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so-and-so and you know he's a pretty

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smart guy he's not gonna exactly oh and

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you know there's their email their spam

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and all kinds of hats and things that go

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on so there is that part of us that just

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has that knee-jerk reaction of you know

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wanting to protect ourselves but I think

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it gets overridden on on social

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networking because we want to be part of

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the crowd you know we're gonna join in

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on all the reindeer games we don't be

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the one who so you don't want to do that

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especially if it's like a cool story you

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know they just discovered this or that

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you know and you know you don't want to

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be the one that goes in ratings on

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everybody's parade you know right now

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you know it's funny because you know

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we're talking about mind control and

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we're talking about it in terms of today

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in a social media and you know earlier I

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mentioned about you know the government

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programs that were so rampant and you

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know probably still are but they

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probably just gone darker I just don't

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you know I just don't go over with

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though yeah

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hurts so much more about things you know

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a few years ago or maybe even a couple

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of decades ago but but what about

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because I was reading about your work

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and you talked about how Egyptians

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practiced mind control and after that I

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want to get into because you said

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something about the Knights Templar pray

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and one of the ways go back to primitive

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times one of the wings of the pray

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interactions and conflicts where and

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maybe even try to control it not new

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human behavior include the desire to

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control the way people if it's to our

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benefit you know and sometimes out of

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hands go back into action times where we

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you know obviously worn around to see

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their personal interactions but where we

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see a lot of its the ritual we see a lot

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of mind control techniques that were

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used in ancient times and primitive as

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well I'm sure where ritual was a very

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formal structured way of getting people

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to position a certain way or believe

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certain things or you know bow down to

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the deities that were worshiped by the

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this particular civilization to keep

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them under control

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so you just structure just ritual and

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included in that ritual was the type of

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language that sort of elaborated on

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following the rules and behaving and

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then later you know when we go into

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Christianity and the Great Western

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religious traditions we see it in their

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rituals as well you know you go to

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church and the talk is all about not

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sinning and behaving the way that Jesus

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and God want you to or although whoever

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you know whatever religion you're not

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going to be following and there's

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different rituals that you go through

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when you go to church and you've got

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baptisms and you know funeral rites and

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all this these types of things that are

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very structured that keep us in a sort

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of on a sort of specific path in terms

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of our behavior our thoughts and our

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actions mmm from that then you cause

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trouble that's right you're not you're

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out of the group and you can't play the

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rewritten zones anymore now that was per

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the attraction of being involved in

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rituals is that you felt a part of a

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group of a unit you and that's where

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that also bleeds over into cult behavior

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the desire to belong to a family or to

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belong to a

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certain group where you feel embraced

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now I see how that really really is

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clear that these rituals and these rules

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that are also practiced together just

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sort of you know give you a clear

273
00:14:57,790 --> 00:14:55,670
message you know this is what you should

274
00:14:59,890 --> 00:14:57,800
do this is what you wouldn't do but what

275
00:15:02,230 --> 00:14:59,900
about some of the you know and later

276
00:15:04,650 --> 00:15:02,240
times in Christianity some of the like

277
00:15:07,330 --> 00:15:04,660
the charismatic churches where people

278
00:15:10,900 --> 00:15:07,340
you know you see a lot in the south

279
00:15:12,940 --> 00:15:10,910
where I'm from and I know your your

280
00:15:15,880 --> 00:15:12,950
co-author on a lot of your work Larry

281
00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:15,890
Flaxman is his from Arkansas so he

282
00:15:22,350 --> 00:15:19,850
probably has had some exposure to some

283
00:15:25,420 --> 00:15:22,360
of this as well but these Cara Matic

284
00:15:27,250 --> 00:15:25,430
charismatic churches where they kind of

285
00:15:30,670 --> 00:15:27,260
work themselves up into a frenzy

286
00:15:34,150 --> 00:15:30,680
sometimes they'll do things like you

287
00:15:37,510 --> 00:15:34,160
know speaking in tongues or you know

288
00:15:40,660 --> 00:15:37,520
falling out you know it's yummy and

289
00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:40,670
they're rapturous they get into a

290
00:15:49,020 --> 00:15:43,970
rapturous state of mind right all way to

291
00:15:52,630 --> 00:15:49,030
people you know in those really remote

292
00:15:54,850 --> 00:15:52,640
hills side churches in Tennessee and in

293
00:15:57,250 --> 00:15:54,860
Mississippi where they handle snakes as

294
00:16:01,300 --> 00:15:57,260
part of a ritual they drink arsenic as

295
00:16:03,580 --> 00:16:01,310
part of a ritual you know so does that

296
00:16:06,790 --> 00:16:03,590
it fit in as well with the mind control

297
00:16:09,490 --> 00:16:06,800
aspect well absolutely and it and the

298
00:16:11,940 --> 00:16:09,500
funny thing is all those people that you

299
00:16:15,430 --> 00:16:11,950
know belong to some of those more

300
00:16:17,710 --> 00:16:15,440
unusual or extreme religions will never

301
00:16:21,220 --> 00:16:17,720
admit is that their rituals are very

302
00:16:25,090 --> 00:16:21,230
similar to those of Santeria and Lou Don

303
00:16:27,790 --> 00:16:25,100
or voodoo where you work yourself into

304
00:16:30,310 --> 00:16:27,800
sort of a rapturous frenzy in order for

305
00:16:33,460 --> 00:16:30,320
the spirit to overtake you that's you

306
00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:33,470
know that's no different from in some of

307
00:16:39,100 --> 00:16:36,770
these Christian denominations where you

308
00:16:41,770 --> 00:16:39,110
know the Holy Spirit moves you and

309
00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:41,780
you're speaking in tongues and holding

310
00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:43,850
your hands up to the sky and whatnot and

311
00:16:48,879 --> 00:16:46,130
the whole point of it is to get you into

312
00:16:51,579 --> 00:16:48,889
a certain state of consciousness it's so

313
00:16:53,590 --> 00:16:51,589
alter your waking state into a more

314
00:16:55,780 --> 00:16:53,600
receptive state where you feel like now

315
00:16:57,160 --> 00:16:55,790
you're channeling God you're you know

316
00:17:00,579 --> 00:16:57,170
you're communicating with the Holy

317
00:17:04,569 --> 00:17:00,589
Spirit or whatever and you know the

318
00:17:06,490 --> 00:17:04,579
thing is is that there's no proof that

319
00:17:07,960 --> 00:17:06,500
that's actually happening I mean if you

320
00:17:11,230 --> 00:17:07,970
want to you know approach it from the

321
00:17:16,509 --> 00:17:11,240
scientific point of view but the belief

322
00:17:18,519 --> 00:17:16,519
is so powerful and that and that creates

323
00:17:21,879 --> 00:17:18,529
for other people in the church the

324
00:17:23,980 --> 00:17:21,889
desire to also do those things to also

325
00:17:26,769 --> 00:17:23,990
be I want to be a channel for the Holy

326
00:17:28,870 --> 00:17:26,779
Spirit how do I do this you know and and

327
00:17:31,299 --> 00:17:28,880
well you have to become one of us and

328
00:17:33,610 --> 00:17:31,309
you have to follow these rules and do

329
00:17:35,769 --> 00:17:33,620
these chantings and say these words and

330
00:17:38,680 --> 00:17:35,779
believe these things and eat these foods

331
00:17:41,259 --> 00:17:38,690
and wear these clothes yada-yada-yada

332
00:17:43,779 --> 00:17:41,269
the whole list of rules and a lot of

333
00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:43,789
times I know in some of the churches I

334
00:17:48,879 --> 00:17:46,730
have some friends and I'm not saying

335
00:17:51,789 --> 00:17:48,889
that all cavalry churches are like this

336
00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:51,799
but I have some friends that literally

337
00:17:59,019 --> 00:17:56,090
escaped cavalry churches because of the

338
00:18:02,440 --> 00:17:59,029
control that the leadership in the

339
00:18:05,830 --> 00:18:02,450
churches were trying to have over their

340
00:18:09,220 --> 00:18:05,840
members to buy into all of these

341
00:18:12,220 --> 00:18:09,230
specific behaviors and to perform these

342
00:18:14,980 --> 00:18:12,230
rituals and have these beliefs and if

343
00:18:18,549 --> 00:18:14,990
you question anything you were cast out

344
00:18:20,940 --> 00:18:18,559
oh my gosh you're not only cast out of

345
00:18:24,129 --> 00:18:20,950
the church but you were chastised and

346
00:18:26,379 --> 00:18:24,139
you know literally blacklisted from your

347
00:18:28,870 --> 00:18:26,389
community if you happen to live in a

348
00:18:31,149 --> 00:18:28,880
community where everybody went to that

349
00:18:35,009 --> 00:18:31,159
same church your children were bullied

350
00:18:37,210 --> 00:18:35,019
at school you know it wasn't just about

351
00:18:39,820 --> 00:18:37,220
misbehaving at church and getting your

352
00:18:43,210 --> 00:18:39,830
hand slapped so it's all about following

353
00:18:45,639 --> 00:18:43,220
a very specific set of behaviors and and

354
00:18:49,360 --> 00:18:45,649
adopting a very specific set of beliefs

355
00:18:52,899 --> 00:18:49,370
and however that can happen they'll do

356
00:18:55,480 --> 00:18:52,909
it you know if the appeal is we handled

357
00:18:58,720 --> 00:18:55,490
snakes and we try to heal diseases

358
00:19:02,890 --> 00:18:58,730
without gonna doctors or we go into a

359
00:19:05,340 --> 00:19:02,900
rapturous spinning frenzy where we

360
00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:05,350
even the Word of God you know whatever

361
00:19:12,970 --> 00:19:11,210
works to to kind of magnetize more

362
00:19:16,690 --> 00:19:12,980
people into the fold

363
00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:16,700
oh the Excel or special they talk

364
00:19:23,530 --> 00:19:19,730
directly to God it sounds almost like

365
00:19:25,630 --> 00:19:23,540
hypnosis doesn't it and yeah why it is

366
00:19:27,250 --> 00:19:25,640
if you think about it yeah I mean it is

367
00:19:30,610 --> 00:19:27,260
yourself if you're you know you're

368
00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:30,620
putting your your that your mind into

369
00:19:35,290 --> 00:19:32,810
another unaltered state an altered state

370
00:19:37,330 --> 00:19:35,300
yeah absolutely yeah and I mean what's

371
00:19:41,260 --> 00:19:37,340
the difference between that and doing

372
00:19:42,610 --> 00:19:41,270
drugs or drinking you're doing it in a

373
00:19:43,780 --> 00:19:42,620
different setting and the fact that

374
00:19:47,890 --> 00:19:43,790
you're with a whole bunch of other

375
00:19:49,930 --> 00:19:47,900
people under the guise of communicating

376
00:19:52,990 --> 00:19:49,940
was you know the Holy Spirit or whatever

377
00:19:56,440 --> 00:19:53,000
that sort of makes it acceptable but

378
00:19:58,180 --> 00:19:56,450
really it is about altering the state of

379
00:20:01,600 --> 00:19:58,190
your consciousness so that you can have

380
00:20:04,630 --> 00:20:01,610
some kind of spiritual experience it is

381
00:20:06,520 --> 00:20:04,640
you know I I wonder how many people have

382
00:20:09,640 --> 00:20:06,530
had my experience like you know grew up

383
00:20:12,250 --> 00:20:09,650
in southeastern Oklahoma which is you

384
00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:12,260
know we considered ourselves proudly

385
00:20:17,620 --> 00:20:15,650
from the south I don't know why but we

386
00:20:20,800 --> 00:20:17,630
were south of the mason-dixon line so I

387
00:20:23,020 --> 00:20:20,810
guess that that qualified us but anyhow

388
00:20:24,940 --> 00:20:23,030
you know grew up in the Southern Baptist

389
00:20:27,630 --> 00:20:24,950
Church which is not a charismatic church

390
00:20:31,450 --> 00:20:27,640
but it's fairly fundamental

391
00:20:34,720 --> 00:20:31,460
fundamentalist Christian Church and we

392
00:20:37,090 --> 00:20:34,730
did have you know people who would you

393
00:20:38,770 --> 00:20:37,100
know the Holy Ghost we didn't call it

394
00:20:41,950 --> 00:20:38,780
the Holy Spirit it was the Holy Ghost

395
00:20:43,330 --> 00:20:41,960
would come upon them and they would come

396
00:20:45,490 --> 00:20:43,340
up to the front of the church and they

397
00:20:47,500 --> 00:20:45,500
would give a testimonial you know they

398
00:20:50,860 --> 00:20:47,510
would testify in front of the church and

399
00:20:54,100 --> 00:20:50,870
I remember especially as a little girl

400
00:20:56,380 --> 00:20:54,110
you know sitting there thinking okay I'm

401
00:20:59,410 --> 00:20:56,390
ready for the Holy Ghost and the Holy

402
00:21:02,290 --> 00:20:59,420
girl you just never never came and so I

403
00:21:03,550 --> 00:21:02,300
thought oh geez I must be really a bad

404
00:21:08,200 --> 00:21:03,560
bad girl

405
00:21:11,020 --> 00:21:08,210
God made something wrong yeah because

406
00:21:13,180 --> 00:21:11,030
Holy Ghost is just ignoring me but where

407
00:21:14,980 --> 00:21:13,190
it did get me and so I'm thinking well

408
00:21:16,289 --> 00:21:14,990
maybe some people are not as susceptible

409
00:21:18,719 --> 00:21:16,299
to

410
00:21:22,249 --> 00:21:18,729
the programming is deeply as others but

411
00:21:24,989 --> 00:21:22,259
then where it was I noticed you know

412
00:21:27,659 --> 00:21:24,999
growing up I had a very you know strong

413
00:21:29,190 --> 00:21:27,669
interest in you know edgy subjects you

414
00:21:30,149 --> 00:21:29,200
know what some might call friends you

415
00:21:32,009 --> 00:21:30,159
know the things that you write about

416
00:21:35,430 --> 00:21:32,019
that we talk about here

417
00:21:38,339 --> 00:21:35,440
no metaphysics paranormal what have you

418
00:21:39,959 --> 00:21:38,349
conspiracy whatever so I had a lot of

419
00:21:42,599 --> 00:21:39,969
interest in things like that but I felt

420
00:21:44,519 --> 00:21:42,609
a little bit guilty like maybe I was

421
00:21:46,949 --> 00:21:44,529
messing around in the devil's business

422
00:21:50,399 --> 00:21:46,959
or something and then when I started to

423
00:21:52,440 --> 00:21:50,409
really read as a young adult books like

424
00:22:03,029 --> 00:21:52,450
Holy Blood Holy Grail which called into

425
00:22:06,209 --> 00:22:03,039
question for me it totally changed the

426
00:22:08,549 --> 00:22:06,219
course of my life and my ruling yeah

427
00:22:11,339 --> 00:22:08,559
absolutely I ended up making a movie

428
00:22:13,919 --> 00:22:11,349
about the whole thing but it was um I

429
00:22:16,259 --> 00:22:13,929
remember thinking oh my gosh I'm

430
00:22:20,310 --> 00:22:16,269
probably gonna go straight to hell for

431
00:22:23,219 --> 00:22:20,320
even reading this book and several more

432
00:22:26,879 --> 00:22:23,229
years before I was able just to shake

433
00:22:29,579 --> 00:22:26,889
all that that Baptist guilt you know so

434
00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:29,589
yeah whether powerful weapon isn't it

435
00:22:35,659 --> 00:22:32,129
guilt and well guilt and shame the two

436
00:22:38,999 --> 00:22:35,669
sisters of my mental and behavioral

437
00:22:42,329 --> 00:22:39,009
control and and they work they got work

438
00:22:44,579 --> 00:22:42,339
I mean I'm a falling Catholic when I was

439
00:22:45,659 --> 00:22:44,589
little I loved the ritual of the

440
00:22:49,139 --> 00:22:45,669
Catholic Church I thought it was

441
00:22:51,209 --> 00:22:49,149
beautiful it was it was rapturous I

442
00:22:53,699 --> 00:22:51,219
remember maybe being seven eight years

443
00:22:55,469 --> 00:22:53,709
old going we would only go to church on

444
00:22:57,509 --> 00:22:55,479
you know Christmas Easter that kind of

445
00:23:00,209 --> 00:22:57,519
thing but I love the lights and the

446
00:23:03,659 --> 00:23:00,219
candles and the way that they you know

447
00:23:05,579 --> 00:23:03,669
did the the you know they spoke

448
00:23:07,829 --> 00:23:05,589
lyrically like they were half singing

449
00:23:10,379 --> 00:23:07,839
and me and I wouldn't go into altered

450
00:23:12,529 --> 00:23:10,389
states as soon as I got older though and

451
00:23:15,089 --> 00:23:12,539
I understood what they were saying and

452
00:23:17,279 --> 00:23:15,099
then it was like all bets are off and

453
00:23:19,739 --> 00:23:17,289
like you I read books like Holy Blood

454
00:23:22,979 --> 00:23:19,749
Holy Grail and you know got into the

455
00:23:25,739 --> 00:23:22,989
whole Magdalenian stuff and that's like

456
00:23:28,979 --> 00:23:25,749
wait a minute and and when the nog

457
00:23:30,090 --> 00:23:28,989
Hammadi texts and I started reading the

458
00:23:31,980 --> 00:23:30,100
different gospel

459
00:23:34,950 --> 00:23:31,990
didn't get included in the Bible and

460
00:23:36,870 --> 00:23:34,960
it's and but a lot of people don't ever

461
00:23:39,360 --> 00:23:36,880
do that they couldn't you know one of

462
00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:39,370
the fallacies about mind control is that

463
00:23:42,420 --> 00:23:40,810
it really is all about controlling your

464
00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:42,430
mind and that's not true

465
00:23:48,210 --> 00:23:44,770
much of mind control involves

466
00:23:50,970 --> 00:23:48,220
controlling the behavior and actions not

467
00:23:52,950 --> 00:23:50,980
just thought and believed but the

468
00:23:54,600 --> 00:23:52,960
behavior of other people and I'm a

469
00:23:56,610 --> 00:23:54,610
really good friend who grew up Southern

470
00:23:58,980 --> 00:23:56,620
Baptists and just the other night we

471
00:24:00,720 --> 00:23:58,990
were talking about her childhood and her

472
00:24:03,390 --> 00:24:00,730
use and you know she was a rebellious

473
00:24:06,060 --> 00:24:03,400
teenager and there you know you either

474
00:24:09,750 --> 00:24:06,070
followed a very specific set of rules

475
00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:09,760
set down by the church or you were you

476
00:24:18,330 --> 00:24:12,010
were a misfit you know you were a cast

477
00:24:19,350 --> 00:24:18,340
out you were a bad girl and that's you

478
00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:19,360
know one of the ways that they

479
00:24:24,060 --> 00:24:21,730
manipulate you is by guilting and

480
00:24:26,130 --> 00:24:24,070
shaming not just the thoughts that go

481
00:24:29,100 --> 00:24:26,140
through your head but the behaviors and

482
00:24:31,620 --> 00:24:29,110
actions and when you get caught you know

483
00:24:33,510 --> 00:24:31,630
you're punished the punished you're sort

484
00:24:35,790 --> 00:24:33,520
of hung out to dry in front of the whole

485
00:24:38,820 --> 00:24:35,800
church well look what the fat girl did

486
00:24:40,380 --> 00:24:38,830
she's a [\h__\h] a [\h__\h] you know yeah of

487
00:24:43,950 --> 00:24:40,390
course it was always unusually with the

488
00:24:46,530 --> 00:24:43,960
women that got treated that way back

489
00:24:47,730 --> 00:24:46,540
yeah I mean what you're saying is so

490
00:24:51,120 --> 00:24:47,740
funny you mentioned Holy Blood Holy

491
00:24:54,780 --> 00:24:51,130
Grail because a lot of times people will

492
00:24:58,110 --> 00:24:54,790
be under the spell of the very cult-like

493
00:25:02,660 --> 00:24:58,120
behavior that churches and religious

494
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:02,670
institutions use and ask if you're lucky

495
00:25:09,540 --> 00:25:06,610
something falls in your path of person

496
00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:09,550
you take a class you know you go out in

497
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:11,530
the woods and meditate and you have

498
00:25:17,190 --> 00:25:14,050
something some sort of an aha moment

499
00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:17,200
that totally wakes you up out of that

500
00:25:22,980 --> 00:25:20,530
spell because it really is like you're

501
00:25:24,870 --> 00:25:22,990
under some type of spell this doesn't

502
00:25:27,210 --> 00:25:24,880
happen for a lot of people or it doesn't

503
00:25:29,790 --> 00:25:27,220
happen until much later in life right

504
00:25:32,220 --> 00:25:29,800
now I think you know so many people are

505
00:25:35,430 --> 00:25:32,230
under the spell of the media in much the

506
00:25:37,470 --> 00:25:35,440
same way you and I are talking about how

507
00:25:40,470 --> 00:25:37,480
people are under the spell of religion

508
00:25:43,950 --> 00:25:40,480
same thing same types of techniques that

509
00:25:46,170 --> 00:25:43,960
are being used and do you think that we

510
00:25:49,110 --> 00:25:46,180
this you know you don't believe what

511
00:25:51,330 --> 00:25:49,120
this newest person says you're you know

512
00:25:53,700 --> 00:25:51,340
what kind of a dummy er you know you're

513
00:25:55,260 --> 00:25:53,710
stupid and you're uneducated and then

514
00:25:58,400 --> 00:25:55,270
the other side saying the same thing

515
00:26:01,080 --> 00:25:58,410
yeah yeah you don't understand this bill

516
00:26:02,550 --> 00:26:01,090
you know the Republicans Democrats are

517
00:26:05,970 --> 00:26:02,560
cheering they're both they're all the

518
00:26:08,790 --> 00:26:05,980
same but they'll find ways to make the

519
00:26:12,150 --> 00:26:08,800
other side look like idiots if they

520
00:26:16,890 --> 00:26:12,160
don't buy into the rhetoric that they're

521
00:26:19,410 --> 00:26:16,900
viewing well you know the the the news

522
00:26:20,790 --> 00:26:19,420
media is kind of an obvious one you know

523
00:26:22,770 --> 00:26:20,800
because they're supposed to be telling

524
00:26:24,810 --> 00:26:22,780
us what's really going on and so we're

525
00:26:28,260 --> 00:26:24,820
supposed to really believe it but do you

526
00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:28,270
think that that that mind control aspect

527
00:26:34,650 --> 00:26:31,450
and I'm getting this from a question in

528
00:26:38,220 --> 00:26:34,660
the chat room and in my experience as

529
00:26:40,620 --> 00:26:38,230
the television film producer I have not

530
00:26:44,190 --> 00:26:40,630
ever had anyone try to control what I

531
00:26:46,140 --> 00:26:44,200
would say except maybe the you know the

532
00:26:49,410 --> 00:26:46,150
the network executives who wanted to

533
00:26:55,050 --> 00:26:49,420
make the story more exciting by you know

534
00:26:57,480 --> 00:26:55,060
putting some sex in or something like

535
00:27:00,420 --> 00:26:57,490
that but the question from the chat room

536
00:27:03,950 --> 00:27:00,430
is from chat which and she says do you

537
00:27:08,490 --> 00:27:03,960
think that corporations like MK use

538
00:27:11,970 --> 00:27:08,500
MKULTRA to control the movie and music

539
00:27:16,680 --> 00:27:11,980
stars to push their products I don't

540
00:27:19,140 --> 00:27:16,690
know about because yeah I'm a writer I'm

541
00:27:22,020 --> 00:27:19,150
working in the film and TV industry I'm

542
00:27:24,060 --> 00:27:22,030
a writer on the novelist nobody controls

543
00:27:25,830 --> 00:27:24,070
what I write about at least not that I

544
00:27:28,650 --> 00:27:25,840
know of so that's where you know where's

545
00:27:30,870 --> 00:27:28,660
that fine line between I believe I am

546
00:27:33,930 --> 00:27:30,880
under hundred percent under my own power

547
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:33,940
right and I write about what I like and

548
00:27:38,070 --> 00:27:36,010
wondering oh you know who's putting

549
00:27:40,980 --> 00:27:38,080
these thoughts in my head and that's

550
00:27:44,780 --> 00:27:40,990
entirely possible however there are

551
00:27:49,380 --> 00:27:44,790
there are movies and television series

552
00:27:53,340 --> 00:27:49,390
that government officials and agents

553
00:27:56,370 --> 00:27:53,350
have consulted on taking part in we do

554
00:27:58,279 --> 00:27:56,380
know that we know you know one third

555
00:28:01,740 --> 00:27:58,289
time yeah

556
00:28:04,769 --> 00:28:01,750
that's my favorite movie and I know

557
00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:04,779
there was 200 times hosts Encounters of

558
00:28:09,810 --> 00:28:07,330
the Third Kind so on the surface it's a

559
00:28:12,090 --> 00:28:09,820
really wonderful movie about an ordinary

560
00:28:14,129 --> 00:28:12,100
man put in its burden airy circumstances

561
00:28:16,980 --> 00:28:14,139
one of the typical plot lines that

562
00:28:19,230 --> 00:28:16,990
you'll find in Hollywood but you know

563
00:28:20,820 --> 00:28:19,240
dogs so dr. J Allen Hynek who was the

564
00:28:23,460 --> 00:28:20,830
head of Project Blue Book at the time

565
00:28:26,669 --> 00:28:23,470
was the consultant on that movie and

566
00:28:30,690 --> 00:28:26,679
there was also a lot of discussion that

567
00:28:33,769 --> 00:28:30,700
even Spielberg had been talking to CIA

568
00:28:37,740 --> 00:28:33,779
and you know other government officials

569
00:28:39,899 --> 00:28:37,750
mainly about what could be shown and

570
00:28:42,330 --> 00:28:39,909
what should be avoided that kind of

571
00:28:45,299 --> 00:28:42,340
thing now that's that's probably very

572
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:45,309
true yeah and there's been some other

573
00:28:51,419 --> 00:28:48,370
situations like that I don't believe in

574
00:28:54,629 --> 00:28:51,429
the I don't I don't believe in the

575
00:28:57,210 --> 00:28:54,639
extreme conspiracy theory that I hear

576
00:28:59,009 --> 00:28:57,220
all the time that you know beyond saying

577
00:29:02,009 --> 00:28:59,019
all these people are all controlled

578
00:29:04,529 --> 00:29:02,019
these are people that are out to make

579
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:04,539
money doing what they love to do they're

580
00:29:10,919 --> 00:29:07,090
extremely successful so they're targets

581
00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:10,929
for everybody's you know spin to put on

582
00:29:17,850 --> 00:29:15,370
them and are they all MKULTRA controlled

583
00:29:20,519 --> 00:29:17,860
wouldn't it be funny if they were you

584
00:29:23,369 --> 00:29:20,529
know I cannot with 100% certainty say no

585
00:29:25,470 --> 00:29:23,379
they're not I don't know but because I'm

586
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:25,480
in that industry I worked for a record I

587
00:29:30,889 --> 00:29:27,730
worked for Warner records for seven

588
00:29:32,879 --> 00:29:30,899
eight years and I knew tons of musicians

589
00:29:36,330 --> 00:29:32,889
and favorite ones

590
00:29:45,990 --> 00:29:36,340
so you know they were and I was married

591
00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:46,000
to a rocker I was a guitar player and a

592
00:29:51,930 --> 00:29:48,610
really great one and he did what he was

593
00:29:54,450 --> 00:29:51,940
in love to do and so I back that's a

594
00:29:56,909 --> 00:29:54,460
really interesting question that is

595
00:29:59,970 --> 00:29:56,919
almost impossible to answer with 100%

596
00:30:03,990 --> 00:29:59,980
certainty because as artists we're just

597
00:30:07,049 --> 00:30:04,000
doing what we love to do and yet you

598
00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:07,059
know our our all of our minds being

599
00:30:11,730 --> 00:30:10,690
manipulated I can't say no and I can't

600
00:30:15,540 --> 00:30:11,740
say yes

601
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:15,550
that was scary on that note take a rake

602
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:17,050
and when we come back we'll try to read

603
00:30:21,390 --> 00:30:18,010
to him ourselves

604
00:30:26,340 --> 00:30:21,400
we'll be back into the deep down so stay

605
00:30:28,140 --> 00:30:26,350
with us welcome back to night vision I'm

606
00:30:30,990 --> 00:30:28,150
your host Renee Barnett if you're just

607
00:30:32,910 --> 00:30:31,000
joining us tonight we have with us

608
00:30:35,010 --> 00:30:32,920
Murray Dee Jones she's author and a

609
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:35,020
screenwriter and we've been talking

610
00:30:43,020 --> 00:30:39,210
about her book mind wars and about how

611
00:30:45,390 --> 00:30:43,030
not only our governments have practiced

612
00:30:47,790 --> 00:30:45,400
mind control and done mind control

613
00:30:50,370 --> 00:30:47,800
research on private citizens and all

614
00:30:52,500 --> 00:30:50,380
that jazz but also how really mind

615
00:30:55,500 --> 00:30:52,510
control has come in to play throughout

616
00:30:59,100 --> 00:30:55,510
history including you know in ancient

617
00:31:00,900 --> 00:30:59,110
times and even up into the the medieval

618
00:31:05,070 --> 00:31:00,910
times of the Knights Templar and others

619
00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:05,080
it's it's a way that people you might it

620
00:31:09,570 --> 00:31:06,970
might not be something obvious it might

621
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:09,580
not be a mind-control program but

622
00:31:13,950 --> 00:31:11,530
they're using certain ways and certain

623
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:13,960
techniques and certain symbols certain

624
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:20,650
language to manipulate us so are we in a

625
00:31:27,020 --> 00:31:22,210
world of hurt Murray what can we do

626
00:31:31,820 --> 00:31:27,030
about this problem or interpersonal

627
00:31:38,510 --> 00:31:34,620
and your friendship and your romantic

628
00:31:41,090 --> 00:31:38,520
relationships there's constant mind

629
00:31:44,280 --> 00:31:41,100
control and behavioral control

630
00:31:57,570 --> 00:31:44,290
manipulation going on whether it's you

631
00:31:59,730 --> 00:31:57,580
know having a parent narcissistic and

632
00:32:02,040 --> 00:31:59,740
and all of the mind manipulation that

633
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:02,050
goes on so again this is part of our

634
00:32:07,770 --> 00:32:05,250
natural human behavior and my feeling is

635
00:32:12,690 --> 00:32:07,780
when you start looking around your own

636
00:32:14,669 --> 00:32:12,700
personal life and how other people try

637
00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:14,679
to get you to think behaving a certain

638
00:32:22,409 --> 00:32:17,650
ways to benefit them and then even

639
00:32:25,260 --> 00:32:22,419
beyond that having you do it yes that

640
00:32:25,620 --> 00:32:25,270
yeah that and we wrote about that in the

641
00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:25,630
book

642
00:32:30,510 --> 00:32:27,730
since we really felt strongly that if

643
00:32:32,930 --> 00:32:30,520
you don't clean up the manipulation that

644
00:32:36,470 --> 00:32:32,940
goes on in here in our individual lives

645
00:32:39,330 --> 00:32:36,480
well continue to fall under the spell of

646
00:32:42,210 --> 00:32:39,340
that safe manipulation on a grander

647
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:42,220
scale whether it's politics religion the

648
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:45,250
government you know what have you and

649
00:32:49,890 --> 00:32:47,770
when you start to wake up to you to

650
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:49,900
where this is happening in your own life

651
00:32:58,770 --> 00:32:52,690
and the type of language that is being

652
00:33:04,290 --> 00:32:58,780
the type of then you start to see

653
00:33:05,850 --> 00:33:04,300
happening on the news wake up to it once

654
00:33:09,750 --> 00:33:05,860
you're aware of it that's where you get

655
00:33:11,820 --> 00:33:09,760
your power back you know I wake up you

656
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:11,830
know we should have our power back then

657
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:14,050
we can figure out how to start hauling

658
00:33:22,530 --> 00:33:19,570
it out you know when I try to you know

659
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:22,540
briefly you know examine you know

660
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:26,290
obviously I can you know just out of

661
00:33:32,100 --> 00:33:28,810
hand you know pick up a couple of

662
00:33:34,890 --> 00:33:32,110
examples of how I myself if tried to

663
00:33:40,110 --> 00:33:34,900
manipulate someone let's say I'm writing

664
00:33:43,110 --> 00:33:40,120
a an email to someone in business and

665
00:33:45,090 --> 00:33:43,120
I'm you know trying to get them to do

666
00:33:48,180 --> 00:33:45,100
business with me or I'm pitching a show

667
00:33:51,630 --> 00:33:48,190
or or something I'm wanting something

668
00:33:55,380 --> 00:33:51,640
from them I'm gonna frame that letter or

669
00:33:57,360 --> 00:33:55,390
that email right in such a way and I'm

670
00:33:59,670 --> 00:33:57,370
going to go back over it and say ooh

671
00:34:03,930 --> 00:33:59,680
this word sounds a little bit better

672
00:34:07,050 --> 00:34:03,940
then this or that and it sort of changes

673
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:07,060
slightly the tone or the meaning you

674
00:34:13,409 --> 00:34:10,450
know I mean like how do you know when

675
00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:13,419
you're doing something that is just

676
00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:16,690
ordinary behavior and ordinary business

677
00:34:20,730 --> 00:34:18,610
because of course you want to put your

678
00:34:22,950 --> 00:34:20,740
best foot forward when you're trying to

679
00:34:26,850 --> 00:34:22,960
close a business deal but when does it

680
00:34:28,530 --> 00:34:26,860
become manipulation or when does it come

681
00:34:30,780 --> 00:34:28,540
become negative I guess it's all

682
00:34:35,090 --> 00:34:30,790
manipulation but when does it oh my god

683
00:34:39,540 --> 00:34:35,100
what do you know you're doing a bad way

684
00:34:43,830 --> 00:34:39,550
well and you're right of me we all use

685
00:34:46,020 --> 00:34:43,840
exaggeration embellishment positive

686
00:34:49,590 --> 00:34:46,030
negative reinforcement

687
00:34:52,700 --> 00:34:49,600
you know praise credit we all use these

688
00:34:56,669 --> 00:34:52,710
same techniques in our personal lives

689
00:34:59,700 --> 00:34:56,679
because that's how that's how we jockey

690
00:35:01,950 --> 00:34:59,710
to get you know the position that we

691
00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:01,960
need for what we feel like we need to

692
00:35:07,830 --> 00:35:05,170
survive and thrive and you're especially

693
00:35:09,930 --> 00:35:07,840
in business you want to get a certain

694
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:09,940
outcome and it's like well what's the

695
00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:11,770
what's the best way for me to get this

696
00:35:18,330 --> 00:35:15,970
outcome this deal or this merger or you

697
00:35:19,950 --> 00:35:18,340
know you and I we we pitch ideas we want

698
00:35:22,860 --> 00:35:19,960
to get them to greenlight one of our

699
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:22,870
ideas and yes there's an awful lot of

700
00:35:27,420 --> 00:35:25,450
manipulation that goes on is the

701
00:35:31,380 --> 00:35:27,430
difference is when you really try to

702
00:35:34,380 --> 00:35:31,390
change another person there's that line

703
00:35:36,870 --> 00:35:34,390
where you you know you can think you can

704
00:35:38,970 --> 00:35:36,880
sort of encourage them to behave or

705
00:35:39,720 --> 00:35:38,980
respond a certain way or to give you

706
00:35:42,150 --> 00:35:39,730
what you want

707
00:35:44,580 --> 00:35:42,160
hopefully it's for both of your benefits

708
00:35:47,430 --> 00:35:44,590
that's always a good thing is if it

709
00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:47,440
hurts the other person if you're trying

710
00:35:51,870 --> 00:35:50,530
to change them you know and you're and

711
00:35:53,820 --> 00:35:51,880
you're using a lot of negative

712
00:35:56,610 --> 00:35:53,830
reinforcement and you're judging and

713
00:35:58,500 --> 00:35:56,620
criticizing and really you know almost

714
00:36:02,010 --> 00:35:58,510
like character destroying their

715
00:36:04,770 --> 00:36:02,020
character I think when it when those

716
00:36:07,890 --> 00:36:04,780
attempts turn negative and you're

717
00:36:10,680 --> 00:36:07,900
hurting somebody or you're manipulating

718
00:36:13,770 --> 00:36:10,690
somebody to get something from them

719
00:36:16,950 --> 00:36:13,780
that's going to hurt them even as it

720
00:36:19,740 --> 00:36:16,960
benefits you you know sure we need to

721
00:36:22,830 --> 00:36:19,750
really look at that behavior how can we

722
00:36:24,750 --> 00:36:22,840
expect our religious and you know

723
00:36:27,990 --> 00:36:24,760
political leaders to behave any

724
00:36:31,860 --> 00:36:28,000
differently when we're making excuses

725
00:36:34,110 --> 00:36:31,870
for those same types of behaviors and I

726
00:36:38,010 --> 00:36:34,120
think it just really is a lot you know a

727
00:36:41,070 --> 00:36:38,020
lot of self-reflection yes when I pitch

728
00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:41,080
a project or you know I might make

729
00:36:47,670 --> 00:36:43,930
myself look really great and I'm pumping

730
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:47,680
up the the verbage and you know I want I

731
00:36:51,870 --> 00:36:49,450
want it I'm giving them the hard sell

732
00:36:53,010 --> 00:36:51,880
and you know when you want to merge with

733
00:36:54,900 --> 00:36:53,020
another company

734
00:36:57,090 --> 00:36:54,910
years given them all of the good reasons

735
00:36:58,920 --> 00:36:57,100
why it's going to help their company if

736
00:37:01,320 --> 00:36:58,930
they merge and how they're gonna benefit

737
00:37:03,900 --> 00:37:01,330
financially and you might leave out some

738
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:03,910
of the negative but I think if you're

739
00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:06,370
really doing things that hurt the other

740
00:37:11,130 --> 00:37:08,890
person or the other people were you

741
00:37:13,140 --> 00:37:11,140
trying to change them where you're

742
00:37:17,700 --> 00:37:13,150
trying to control them in a very

743
00:37:20,490 --> 00:37:17,710
oppressive way and make them bad make

744
00:37:23,460 --> 00:37:20,500
them the enemy if they go against what

745
00:37:25,170 --> 00:37:23,470
you want you know and I think it's just

746
00:37:29,010 --> 00:37:25,180
something that we all have to kind of

747
00:37:32,220 --> 00:37:29,020
feel where is that line that's a great

748
00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:32,230
question okay I guess you know if you

749
00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:34,690
have some self-awareness or you're

750
00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:37,930
developing self-awareness I guess you

751
00:37:43,530 --> 00:37:40,930
know you kind of know if something is is

752
00:37:45,630 --> 00:37:43,540
is not gonna do somebody else you know

753
00:37:49,620 --> 00:37:45,640
it's like you found it can use your own

754
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:49,630
gut in your own conscience I think maybe

755
00:37:56,420 --> 00:37:51,970
in in those instances I don't know but

756
00:37:58,770 --> 00:37:56,430
it's true I mean there is a lot of

757
00:38:02,160 --> 00:37:58,780
manipulation and it seems like not all

758
00:38:04,260 --> 00:38:02,170
of it is entirely bad so we have to be

759
00:38:05,910 --> 00:38:04,270
discerning just like we do with the news

760
00:38:08,100 --> 00:38:05,920
just like we do with everything is

761
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:08,110
actually because you know what we're

762
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:09,850
human beings and we're all trying to get

763
00:38:14,580 --> 00:38:12,370
what we need and a lot of times what

764
00:38:17,460 --> 00:38:14,590
stands in our way other human beings and

765
00:38:21,060 --> 00:38:17,470
I think you see this more than anywhere

766
00:38:25,590 --> 00:38:21,070
else in romantic relationships romantic

767
00:38:29,220 --> 00:38:25,600
relationships are the perfect model for

768
00:38:32,580 --> 00:38:29,230
mind control and behavioral control that

769
00:38:34,500 --> 00:38:32,590
you can then extrapolate to the bigger

770
00:38:37,860 --> 00:38:34,510
things like government politics and

771
00:38:39,150 --> 00:38:37,870
religion the way that we you know try to

772
00:38:42,360 --> 00:38:39,160
get our needs met

773
00:38:44,850 --> 00:38:42,370
sometimes desperately and and the

774
00:38:48,780 --> 00:38:44,860
violence and abuse that can arise and

775
00:38:50,460 --> 00:38:48,790
the addiction you know to another person

776
00:38:53,250 --> 00:38:50,470
it's just the same as a drug addiction

777
00:38:55,650 --> 00:38:53,260
and the cult-like behavior is that you

778
00:38:58,410 --> 00:38:55,660
know he loves me he loves me not and and

779
00:39:01,620 --> 00:38:58,420
just the craziness of a romantic

780
00:39:02,460 --> 00:39:01,630
relationship is such a great model or

781
00:39:06,900 --> 00:39:02,470
blueprint

782
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:06,910
I always feel like you know I was

783
00:39:11,460 --> 00:39:08,890
I look at some of our government leaders

784
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:11,470
as everyone else does and and on all

785
00:39:15,510 --> 00:39:13,810
sides of the fence and thinks oh my god

786
00:39:17,690 --> 00:39:15,520
is this the best we can do but then when

787
00:39:21,090 --> 00:39:17,700
I realizes they're they're our

788
00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:21,100
representatives they represent us and

789
00:39:26,970 --> 00:39:23,770
there is so much truth in that

790
00:39:31,890 --> 00:39:26,980
because real I cheat steal manipulate

791
00:39:34,950 --> 00:39:31,900
you know judge could do all the same

792
00:39:36,810 --> 00:39:34,960
sins that they are doing they just do

793
00:39:40,290 --> 00:39:36,820
monitor yourself and it affects more

794
00:39:41,670 --> 00:39:40,300
people so I think one of you know you

795
00:39:44,370 --> 00:39:41,680
were saying well how do we deal with

796
00:39:47,610 --> 00:39:44,380
this what good can come out of this well

797
00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:47,620
get control of yourself get control of

798
00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:49,570
your thoughts get control of your life

799
00:39:56,070 --> 00:39:52,810
your life and and really try to start

800
00:39:58,740 --> 00:39:56,080
identifying where you have been just

801
00:40:01,740 --> 00:39:58,750
sort of blindly lead into different

802
00:40:04,470 --> 00:40:01,750
beliefs and ideals that maybe you really

803
00:40:06,570 --> 00:40:04,480
don't even agree with they came from

804
00:40:09,060 --> 00:40:06,580
parents that came from peers they came

805
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:09,070
from your religious and situations that

806
00:40:14,100 --> 00:40:12,010
came from your college professors who

807
00:40:17,070 --> 00:40:14,110
are you I think that really is at the

808
00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:17,080
bottom of this you know who are you and

809
00:40:24,090 --> 00:40:20,530
they just bought are you yeah you know

810
00:40:27,150 --> 00:40:24,100
who who are you for real and who are you

811
00:40:28,860 --> 00:40:27,160
in the eyes of those that wish to use

812
00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:28,870
and manipulate you those are two

813
00:40:33,570 --> 00:40:31,330
different people oftentimes they really

814
00:40:34,530 --> 00:40:33,580
are I mean my biggest pet peeve is you

815
00:40:36,930 --> 00:40:34,540
know when you're having a discussion

816
00:40:40,170 --> 00:40:36,940
with someone you feel like you're making

817
00:40:42,330 --> 00:40:40,180
a point and you know some kind of really

818
00:40:44,790 --> 00:40:42,340
salient point and then they say well

819
00:40:47,190 --> 00:40:44,800
that's just not how I was raised and you

820
00:40:54,660 --> 00:40:47,200
want to go like oh my god that's exactly

821
00:40:56,970 --> 00:40:54,670
what I did that thing we used to say is

822
00:41:01,230 --> 00:40:56,980
kids everybody jumped off a cliff would

823
00:41:06,150 --> 00:41:01,240
you do it too you know okay there's a

824
00:41:08,460 --> 00:41:06,160
lot of truth in that saying you know

825
00:41:12,270 --> 00:41:08,470
getting aware of ourselves and getting

826
00:41:14,460 --> 00:41:12,280
control of ourselves I think your book

827
00:41:15,720 --> 00:41:14,470
on and please forgive me I don't have

828
00:41:17,730 --> 00:41:15,730
the title of it right here in front of

829
00:41:20,460 --> 00:41:17,740
me as I should have the art book on

830
00:41:22,980 --> 00:41:20,470
archetypes again how are

831
00:41:25,140 --> 00:41:22,990
right yes in how we use those to

832
00:41:27,690 --> 00:41:25,150
overcome this programming and reprogram

833
00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:27,700
ourselves how does that come into play

834
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:31,930
and could you first Oh before I say that

835
00:41:36,650 --> 00:41:33,970
I've got to ask you a question from the

836
00:41:40,349 --> 00:41:36,660
chat room because I asked them there

837
00:41:44,450 --> 00:41:40,359
asks please ask Marie her views on the

838
00:41:49,500 --> 00:41:44,460
role of the pineal gland real or fiction

839
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:49,510
that have any part don't well yeah and I

840
00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:51,970
mean I think it's kind of dormant and

841
00:41:57,930 --> 00:41:55,330
most people and I don't think it's

842
00:42:01,920 --> 00:41:57,940
fictional at all I think it's the third

843
00:42:04,530 --> 00:42:01,930
eye that is so often referred to in you

844
00:42:09,109 --> 00:42:04,540
know missing and some of the religious

845
00:42:12,560 --> 00:42:09,119
texts the processing the problem is

846
00:42:15,660 --> 00:42:12,570
learning to see through that third eye

847
00:42:18,260 --> 00:42:15,670
activating that gland I don't know a lot

848
00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:18,270
about it from what I understand

849
00:42:24,420 --> 00:42:22,810
scientifically it's kind of treated

850
00:42:29,849 --> 00:42:24,430
almost like an afterthought like a

851
00:42:32,790 --> 00:42:29,859
dormant gland and yet could be the basis

852
00:42:34,530 --> 00:42:32,800
for spiritual experiences you know

853
00:42:38,550 --> 00:42:34,540
things that we refer to as paranormal

854
00:42:42,660 --> 00:42:38,560
experiences altered states of

855
00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:42,670
consciousness so no I would not say it's

856
00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:44,890
fictional at all I think that there

857
00:42:49,770 --> 00:42:46,570
might be a lot of misinformation out

858
00:42:52,230 --> 00:42:49,780
there about what it is sure you know if

859
00:42:53,880 --> 00:42:52,240
you pure ly Google any kind of

860
00:42:56,160 --> 00:42:53,890
scientific research you're going to see

861
00:43:00,599 --> 00:42:56,170
you know everything from the medical

862
00:43:02,940 --> 00:43:00,609
point of view but no I mean I something

863
00:43:06,450 --> 00:43:02,950
that fascinates and intrigues me too and

864
00:43:09,750 --> 00:43:06,460
every now and then I think you know just

865
00:43:12,470 --> 00:43:09,760
as with right people who research with

866
00:43:18,210 --> 00:43:12,480
DMT and don't ask me to name the whole

867
00:43:20,609 --> 00:43:18,220
die messy you know is present in very

868
00:43:22,859 --> 00:43:20,619
small amounts in the human brain when

869
00:43:24,780 --> 00:43:22,869
it's activated could that be what's

870
00:43:27,420 --> 00:43:24,790
creating paranormal and religious

871
00:43:28,770 --> 00:43:27,430
rapture spiritual experiences and I

872
00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:28,780
think it's the same with the plane a

873
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:34,090
land yeah and do you think

874
00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:36,010
the doorway to other universes there's

875
00:43:42,210 --> 00:43:39,130
all kinds of labels that I hear or when

876
00:43:46,710 --> 00:43:42,220
you say that you know and I agree that a

877
00:43:49,650 --> 00:43:46,720
lot of people in their pineal gland is

878
00:43:51,540 --> 00:43:49,660
lying dormant do you think that is part

879
00:43:55,350 --> 00:43:51,550
of our programming because certainly if

880
00:43:59,190 --> 00:43:55,360
everybody's third eye was wide open we

881
00:44:00,480 --> 00:43:59,200
wouldn't accept able to control well I

882
00:44:03,240 --> 00:44:00,490
think I've heard too that there is

883
00:44:07,230 --> 00:44:03,250
actual I could say the word

884
00:44:10,740 --> 00:44:07,240
calcification of the pineal gland that

885
00:44:12,210 --> 00:44:10,750
occurs when it's not used yeah and I

886
00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:12,220
think that's you know par for the course

887
00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:14,530
for a lot of supress of the human body

888
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:16,930
that especially parts of our brain that

889
00:44:20,370 --> 00:44:19,090
are dormant that are yet activated and

890
00:44:24,210 --> 00:44:20,380
other people like if you look at

891
00:44:25,950 --> 00:44:24,220
prodigies and savants yeah they're you

892
00:44:29,580 --> 00:44:25,960
know definitely using parts of the

893
00:44:33,330 --> 00:44:29,590
brains that some of us probably you know

894
00:44:35,190 --> 00:44:33,340
rarely touch upon so I know that there's

895
00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:35,200
a lot of talk about the pineal gland

896
00:44:41,550 --> 00:44:37,930
being calcified or having calcification

897
00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:41,560
because it doesn't get used however and

898
00:44:46,410 --> 00:44:42,850
then you hear you know a lot of

899
00:44:49,980 --> 00:44:46,420
metaphysical spiritual writers talk

900
00:44:51,750 --> 00:44:49,990
about when it's activated when you look

901
00:44:54,860 --> 00:44:51,760
through and I'm not talking about

902
00:44:57,060 --> 00:44:54,870
literally looking you know we're good

903
00:44:59,430 --> 00:44:57,070
looking at something the way that you

904
00:45:03,740 --> 00:44:59,440
would visually but when you experience

905
00:45:06,720 --> 00:45:03,750
or perceive through that third eye

906
00:45:09,690 --> 00:45:06,730
that's where you get the real truth

907
00:45:16,190 --> 00:45:09,700
that's where you actually find clarity

908
00:45:18,720 --> 00:45:16,200
but we are conditioned mind control as a

909
00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:18,730
society to believe that what we see with

910
00:45:24,990 --> 00:45:22,330
our two eyeballs is the truth that what

911
00:45:28,140 --> 00:45:25,000
we see visually and what we perceive

912
00:45:30,060 --> 00:45:28,150
visually is reality but we you know come

913
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:30,070
on our our quantum Asiya reticle

914
00:45:34,980 --> 00:45:32,050
physicists are constantly telling us no

915
00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:34,990
no there's a lot a lot more to reality

916
00:45:41,490 --> 00:45:37,810
than what you see with your two eyes and

917
00:45:45,450 --> 00:45:41,500
what meets the eye and so perhaps that

918
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:45,460
gland when it's active when it's working

919
00:45:49,499 --> 00:45:47,890
properly is where we get to

920
00:45:51,900 --> 00:45:49,509
see we had to precede those other

921
00:45:53,339 --> 00:45:51,910
realities and I don't know that that's

922
00:45:55,680 --> 00:45:53,349
something that were meant to do all the

923
00:45:59,430 --> 00:45:55,690
time because if you think about it it

924
00:46:01,470 --> 00:45:59,440
would be really hard to function in the

925
00:46:04,859 --> 00:46:01,480
life that we are consciously aware of

926
00:46:08,069 --> 00:46:04,869
which is this one if we were constantly

927
00:46:10,979 --> 00:46:08,079
being exposed to other universes or

928
00:46:14,519 --> 00:46:10,989
timelines or realities or dimensions or

929
00:46:16,859 --> 00:46:14,529
what-have-you or even having spiritual

930
00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:16,869
or paranormal or religious experiences

931
00:46:22,079 --> 00:46:19,690
24/7 I honestly think that would drive

932
00:46:24,239 --> 00:46:22,089
people crazy and I know crazy isn't

933
00:46:24,930 --> 00:46:24,249
saying it would you win it them in

934
00:46:31,650 --> 00:46:24,940
balance

935
00:46:34,440 --> 00:46:31,660
it probably has in certain people yeah a

936
00:46:38,130 --> 00:46:34,450
lot of our great artists and musicians

937
00:46:42,690 --> 00:46:38,140
and geniuses you you know they were not

938
00:46:45,059 --> 00:46:42,700
able to live the normal realities that

939
00:46:46,979 --> 00:46:45,069
we take for granted because they're they

940
00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:46,989
were more activated than we were even

941
00:46:51,720 --> 00:46:49,210
I'm just speculating here you know even

942
00:46:54,390 --> 00:46:51,730
Einstein you know he could barely you

943
00:46:57,269 --> 00:46:54,400
know find his own house you know he was

944
00:46:58,710 --> 00:46:57,279
so much it's so funny because my dad my

945
00:47:01,170 --> 00:46:58,720
dad passed away a few years though he

946
00:47:03,720 --> 00:47:01,180
was a geophysicist he was a scientist

947
00:47:05,489 --> 00:47:03,730
we saw his pieces he was like this

948
00:47:08,130 --> 00:47:05,499
brilliant scientist but he couldn't

949
00:47:10,229 --> 00:47:08,140
match his socks really you know he was

950
00:47:12,509 --> 00:47:10,239
like that when it came to life she was

951
00:47:15,989 --> 00:47:12,519
inept yeah we would and he would laugh

952
00:47:20,249 --> 00:47:15,999
about it too but you know as a scientist

953
00:47:23,430 --> 00:47:20,259
he was brilliant he could see realities

954
00:47:27,180 --> 00:47:23,440
that you know but then he couldn't find

955
00:47:30,420 --> 00:47:27,190
two pair two black socks and that will

956
00:47:32,039 --> 00:47:30,430
be true and I like to think that when

957
00:47:33,779 --> 00:47:32,049
we're having these discussions and

958
00:47:36,059 --> 00:47:33,789
people in the chat room that anybody who

959
00:47:39,029 --> 00:47:36,069
is interested in this kind of thing and

960
00:47:42,420 --> 00:47:39,039
opens their mind to it is getting rid of

961
00:47:45,180 --> 00:47:42,430
some of that calcification and getting

962
00:47:48,420 --> 00:47:45,190
it active again and and trying to

963
00:47:50,729 --> 00:47:48,430
perceive the the real truth that

964
00:47:53,910 --> 00:47:50,739
underlies all realities if we can ever

965
00:47:59,009 --> 00:47:53,920
possibly do that so just the act of

966
00:48:01,680 --> 00:47:59,019
seeking the truth wanting the truth it's

967
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:01,690
actually part of the activation process

968
00:48:09,540 --> 00:48:07,450
I would think that it'd be there further

969
00:48:11,940 --> 00:48:09,550
English did have that desire without

970
00:48:14,040 --> 00:48:11,950
that desire I guess there's there's no

971
00:48:18,330 --> 00:48:14,050
further development but now what about

972
00:48:20,690 --> 00:48:18,340
the archetypes can you explain just you

973
00:48:24,950 --> 00:48:20,700
know in case someone listening may not

974
00:48:27,300 --> 00:48:24,960
have a clear idea what is an archetype

975
00:48:30,570 --> 00:48:27,310
well one of the reasons why I wrote this

976
00:48:38,160 --> 00:48:30,580
book was after my mind words I was like

977
00:48:40,230 --> 00:48:38,170
oh my god well guess what I think even

978
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:40,240
most people have heard it said that 90%

979
00:48:45,870 --> 00:48:43,570
of your behavior and your actions

980
00:48:48,330 --> 00:48:45,880
beliefs who you are is programmed in

981
00:48:53,010 --> 00:48:48,340
your subconscious your conscious mind is

982
00:48:55,410 --> 00:48:53,020
clueless so 90% and I've seen that

983
00:48:58,080 --> 00:48:55,420
amount you know in different studies and

984
00:49:00,030 --> 00:48:58,090
things that's like the average so what

985
00:49:02,600 --> 00:49:00,040
that means is that a very large part of

986
00:49:05,220 --> 00:49:02,610
who you are as a human being is on

987
00:49:07,140 --> 00:49:05,230
automatic pilot you're not even aware

988
00:49:07,620 --> 00:49:07,150
that you're not aware of where it came

989
00:49:10,170 --> 00:49:07,630
from

990
00:49:11,580 --> 00:49:10,180
you're not aware why you believe certain

991
00:49:13,500 --> 00:49:11,590
you don't even question it why because

992
00:49:16,050 --> 00:49:13,510
we're all busy we don't have time to

993
00:49:18,750 --> 00:49:16,060
slow down and go you know why the hell

994
00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:18,760
did the same patterns keep showing up in

995
00:49:22,770 --> 00:49:21,010
my life where did this all start why do

996
00:49:24,990 --> 00:49:22,780
I believe this it doesn't really feel

997
00:49:27,630 --> 00:49:25,000
right this is resonate how why if I

998
00:49:31,140 --> 00:49:27,640
believe this on my life so I wrote the

999
00:49:33,240 --> 00:49:31,150
book because I had been going through a

1000
00:49:36,540 --> 00:49:33,250
period where a lot of very specific

1001
00:49:40,830 --> 00:49:36,550
behavioral patterns kept raising their

1002
00:49:44,370 --> 00:49:40,840
ugly head in my life and I noticed how

1003
00:49:44,940 --> 00:49:44,380
we label ourselves I'm an alcoholic I'm

1004
00:49:47,520 --> 00:49:44,950
going at it

1005
00:49:49,860 --> 00:49:47,530
dyma I'm just you know I'm skinny I'm

1006
00:49:53,340 --> 00:49:49,870
fat I'm ugly

1007
00:49:57,540 --> 00:49:53,350
you know we label ourselves we we choose

1008
00:49:59,100 --> 00:49:57,550
symbols by which we express ourselves

1009
00:50:01,950 --> 00:49:59,110
I'm a writer

1010
00:50:04,020 --> 00:50:01,960
well I most stay-at-home mom I'm an

1011
00:50:06,300 --> 00:50:04,030
entrepreneur okay so everything that we

1012
00:50:09,630 --> 00:50:06,310
use to express ourselves kind of comes

1013
00:50:13,700 --> 00:50:09,640
down to symbol but do those symbols

1014
00:50:15,150 --> 00:50:13,710
service now archetypes are very specific

1015
00:50:20,230 --> 00:50:15,160
Universal

1016
00:50:23,290 --> 00:50:20,240
symbols that are found in in myth and

1017
00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:23,300
story and religion and they're found in

1018
00:50:28,720 --> 00:50:26,210
every aspect of life and what makes them

1019
00:50:32,230 --> 00:50:28,730
so powerful is that they exist in what

1020
00:50:34,930 --> 00:50:32,240
Carl Jung the great psychoanalyst called

1021
00:50:37,900 --> 00:50:34,940
the collective unconscious and the

1022
00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:37,910
collective unconscious is a part of each

1023
00:50:44,290 --> 00:50:42,290
and every human being that is like just

1024
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:44,300
below the level of the subconscious mind

1025
00:50:49,750 --> 00:50:48,290
and it unifies us but there's a whole

1026
00:50:52,300 --> 00:50:49,760
lot of crap down there that we don't

1027
00:50:56,250 --> 00:50:52,310
even question get it dry and use our

1028
00:50:59,380 --> 00:50:56,260
lives and that's where archetypes live

1029
00:51:02,080 --> 00:50:59,390
so the archetypes like the goddess the

1030
00:51:05,350 --> 00:51:02,090
hero the villain the victim that's a big

1031
00:51:10,090 --> 00:51:05,360
one in society right now you know the

1032
00:51:13,720 --> 00:51:10,100
anti zero V the the mother the father

1033
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:13,730
figure the Prince the diva there's just

1034
00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:15,770
so many different archetypes that I go

1035
00:51:20,410 --> 00:51:18,170
through in the book talk about what they

1036
00:51:23,520 --> 00:51:20,420
are were they kind of originated from

1037
00:51:27,250 --> 00:51:23,530
and how they are influencing our lives

1038
00:51:30,310 --> 00:51:27,260
and the key is that if we slow down long

1039
00:51:34,090 --> 00:51:30,320
enough to really look at the way that we

1040
00:51:37,570 --> 00:51:34,100
describe ourselves and also look at the

1041
00:51:39,490 --> 00:51:37,580
way other people see us that's when we

1042
00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:39,500
can identify the archetypes that are

1043
00:51:46,180 --> 00:51:42,050
driving our behaviors and actions and

1044
00:51:51,190 --> 00:51:46,190
believe from me for years the big one

1045
00:51:54,160 --> 00:51:51,200
was victim oh my gosh and I got to a

1046
00:51:57,550 --> 00:51:54,170
point where I was sick and tired of

1047
00:52:00,190 --> 00:51:57,560
being a victim and I really have a look

1048
00:52:02,920 --> 00:52:00,200
at where did this start or how is it

1049
00:52:05,770 --> 00:52:02,930
perpetuated how am I still buying into

1050
00:52:07,450 --> 00:52:05,780
this archetypal symbol in my life now

1051
00:52:08,830 --> 00:52:07,460
how do I change it I don't want to be

1052
00:52:12,550 --> 00:52:08,840
victim anymore I want to be a warrior

1053
00:52:14,680 --> 00:52:12,560
and I started doing certain processes

1054
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:14,690
some of which are in the book in order

1055
00:52:19,570 --> 00:52:17,210
to switch out the archetypes that I

1056
00:52:22,630 --> 00:52:19,580
thought were not helpful and serving me

1057
00:52:27,040 --> 00:52:22,640
well and replace them with them more

1058
00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:27,050
empowering positive beneficial powerful

1059
00:52:31,420 --> 00:52:28,490
archetype

1060
00:52:33,540 --> 00:52:31,430
because really everything is you know

1061
00:52:34,750 --> 00:52:33,550
we're all a hodgepodge of different

1062
00:52:38,290 --> 00:52:34,760
archetypes

1063
00:52:40,530 --> 00:52:38,300
it's the ones that we allow to control

1064
00:52:43,540 --> 00:52:40,540
us there's that mind control connection

1065
00:52:46,240 --> 00:52:43,550
that create the life that we're living

1066
00:52:48,280 --> 00:52:46,250
so if you say to yourself how the hell

1067
00:52:50,950 --> 00:52:48,290
did I get here

1068
00:52:53,170 --> 00:52:50,960
how why is my life like this my life is

1069
00:52:55,180 --> 00:52:53,180
a mess I you know I'm not married to the

1070
00:52:58,480 --> 00:52:55,190
person that I love a blood and it's a

1071
00:53:00,339 --> 00:52:58,490
job that I love I'm unhealthy well if

1072
00:53:03,120 --> 00:53:00,349
you really start to look at the

1073
00:53:06,700 --> 00:53:03,130
behavioral patterns that got you there

1074
00:53:09,400 --> 00:53:06,710
it is because you bought into certain

1075
00:53:12,880 --> 00:53:09,410
symbols that were either given to you

1076
00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:12,890
from other people or you bought into

1077
00:53:18,930 --> 00:53:15,530
yourself along the path of your life and

1078
00:53:21,400 --> 00:53:18,940
now you have the power to identify them

1079
00:53:25,060 --> 00:53:21,410
decide which ones you get to keep and

1080
00:53:34,000 --> 00:53:25,070
kick the other ones to the curd you mean

1081
00:53:35,680 --> 00:53:34,010
like the dirty girl archetype another

1082
00:53:38,650 --> 00:53:35,690
thing with archetypes is how you spin

1083
00:53:41,740 --> 00:53:38,660
them because that's not of you know God

1084
00:53:44,680 --> 00:53:41,750
and Goddess or two of the the archetypes

1085
00:53:46,450 --> 00:53:44,690
that Carl Jung he had a head of about 12

1086
00:53:49,030 --> 00:53:46,460
and some of them kind of have swapped

1087
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:49,040
out here and there that he felt were

1088
00:53:53,829 --> 00:53:52,010
really the most universal but so you can

1089
00:53:56,710 --> 00:53:53,839
think of yourself as a goddess in a

1090
00:53:59,170 --> 00:53:56,720
positive way but you can also turn that

1091
00:54:04,359 --> 00:53:59,180
negative and be just a diva

1092
00:54:05,829 --> 00:54:04,369
you know bi TCH and think that you're

1093
00:54:10,480 --> 00:54:05,839
you know and be arrogant narcissistic

1094
00:54:14,130 --> 00:54:10,490
about it so each archetype has a sort of

1095
00:54:17,560 --> 00:54:14,140
a positive and a negative spin to it I

1096
00:54:20,560 --> 00:54:17,570
like you know for me really swapping out

1097
00:54:22,599 --> 00:54:20,570
the victim for warrior was so important

1098
00:54:24,700 --> 00:54:22,609
and he turned me into a completely

1099
00:54:27,040 --> 00:54:24,710
different person but I have to be really

1100
00:54:32,109 --> 00:54:27,050
careful that I don't allow the warrior

1101
00:54:35,650 --> 00:54:32,119
to become more like mmm that's when that

1102
00:54:38,560 --> 00:54:35,660
archetype has gone a little too far it

1103
00:54:40,240 --> 00:54:38,570
can be a warrior for your own benefit

1104
00:54:42,220 --> 00:54:40,250
for good for your kids your family

1105
00:54:44,740 --> 00:54:42,230
whatever but if you become more

1106
00:54:47,800 --> 00:54:44,750
like that's you know then you've kind of

1107
00:54:50,500 --> 00:54:47,810
gone into the negative so I love this

1108
00:54:54,880 --> 00:54:50,510
book it's it's one of the first times

1109
00:54:57,760 --> 00:54:54,890
I've really been able to you know really

1110
00:55:00,730 --> 00:54:57,770
look at my own behaviors and then lay

1111
00:55:03,220 --> 00:55:00,740
them down what I've learned and what I

1112
00:55:05,080 --> 00:55:03,230
am learning in a way that I hope and I

1113
00:55:08,349 --> 00:55:05,090
think the feedback already has been

1114
00:55:11,170 --> 00:55:08,359
fantastic that will help other people oh

1115
00:55:13,480 --> 00:55:11,180
that's that's great you know we're gonna

1116
00:55:15,099 --> 00:55:13,490
talk a little bit more about that after

1117
00:55:18,599 --> 00:55:15,109
the break we're going to talk more about

1118
00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:18,609
archetypes and how they can help us and

1119
00:55:23,500 --> 00:55:21,530
also we're gonna get back into the dark

1120
00:55:32,410 --> 00:55:23,510
side before we go tonight we're going to

1121
00:55:37,750 --> 00:55:34,680
[Music]

1122
00:55:39,670 --> 00:55:37,760
hey welcome back to night vision I'm

1123
00:55:41,200 --> 00:55:39,680
having such a good time with my guests

1124
00:55:43,359 --> 00:55:41,210
tonight when Reedy Jones

1125
00:55:45,880 --> 00:55:43,369
author and screenwriter we've been

1126
00:55:48,250 --> 00:55:45,890
talking about mind control and how we've

1127
00:55:49,720 --> 00:55:48,260
been programmed you know our whole lives

1128
00:55:53,380 --> 00:55:49,730
and not only our whole lives but

1129
00:55:55,450 --> 00:55:53,390
throughout the centuries either you know

1130
00:55:58,120 --> 00:55:55,460
people that have a mind control program

1131
00:56:00,670 --> 00:55:58,130
or they're just practicing manipulative

1132
00:56:03,070 --> 00:56:00,680
ways on us and it sort of worked its way

1133
00:56:04,720 --> 00:56:03,080
down through time and it's actually as

1134
00:56:06,910 --> 00:56:04,730
according to Murray is sort of part of

1135
00:56:10,060 --> 00:56:06,920
our human nature to want to control

1136
00:56:11,740 --> 00:56:10,070
things and want to control others so we

1137
00:56:14,140 --> 00:56:11,750
kind of have to watch that in our in our

1138
00:56:18,190 --> 00:56:14,150
own cells we've been talking about then

1139
00:56:21,849 --> 00:56:18,200
after that how to use archetypes to sort

1140
00:56:25,630 --> 00:56:21,859
of change our view of ourselves and in

1141
00:56:29,349 --> 00:56:25,640
in so doing sort of change our direction

1142
00:56:31,380 --> 00:56:29,359
in life and be more positive and going

1143
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:31,390
more of a direction that we want to go

1144
00:56:38,650 --> 00:56:34,970
so we now you talked about how you use

1145
00:56:42,690 --> 00:56:38,660
the the archetype of the warrior so now

1146
00:56:46,359 --> 00:56:42,700
how did you when you say you used that

1147
00:56:48,790 --> 00:56:46,369
what how did you use it did you just

1148
00:56:52,630 --> 00:56:48,800
start envisioning yourself that way or

1149
00:56:54,820 --> 00:56:52,640
how do you use that archetype when I was

1150
00:56:56,080 --> 00:56:54,830
writing the book I actually interviewed

1151
00:56:58,540 --> 00:56:56,090
a couple of people that had

1152
00:57:00,100 --> 00:56:58,550
different really you know kind of cool

1153
00:57:03,790 --> 00:57:00,110
techniques that I actually put in the

1154
00:57:06,250 --> 00:57:03,800
book meditations and visualizations that

1155
00:57:08,620 --> 00:57:06,260
were really helpful here's the thing

1156
00:57:11,730 --> 00:57:08,630
we're fighting we're fighting not only

1157
00:57:14,290 --> 00:57:11,740
the subconscious mind which is

1158
00:57:16,630 --> 00:57:14,300
unbelievably powerful way more powerful

1159
00:57:19,750 --> 00:57:16,640
than our conscious mind mostly because

1160
00:57:21,850 --> 00:57:19,760
we have no idea everything that's in it

1161
00:57:24,550 --> 00:57:21,860
from the time that we were born you know

1162
00:57:28,090 --> 00:57:24,560
just all of the past memories and

1163
00:57:30,700 --> 00:57:28,100
experiences and and beliefs are all

1164
00:57:32,770 --> 00:57:30,710
accumulated there but then as Carl Jung

1165
00:57:35,680 --> 00:57:32,780
said suggest there's this collective

1166
00:57:37,510 --> 00:57:35,690
unconscious because even below that and

1167
00:57:40,870 --> 00:57:37,520
it's almost like a collective

1168
00:57:42,730 --> 00:57:40,880
subconscious mind but we all share so

1169
00:57:45,880 --> 00:57:42,740
that's one of the reasons why certain

1170
00:57:48,700 --> 00:57:45,890
movies or TV shows or stories or novels

1171
00:57:51,910 --> 00:57:48,710
resonate resonate with so many people

1172
00:57:55,390 --> 00:57:51,920
because they're universal and that's why

1173
00:57:57,970 --> 00:57:55,400
you know fairy tales and Disney stories

1174
00:58:00,720 --> 00:57:57,980
and you know the boy meets girl love

1175
00:58:03,160 --> 00:58:00,730
stories there's certain types of music

1176
00:58:06,940 --> 00:58:03,170
that doesn't matter where you come from

1177
00:58:09,520 --> 00:58:06,950
what country or or nationality or you

1178
00:58:12,580 --> 00:58:09,530
know what your belief system is they

1179
00:58:16,720 --> 00:58:12,590
resonate those are universal and they're

1180
00:58:20,320 --> 00:58:16,730
archetypal so but but when that comes

1181
00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:20,330
down to you as an individual if we don't

1182
00:58:26,350 --> 00:58:23,810
stop and take a look at the behaviors

1183
00:58:28,510 --> 00:58:26,360
and the thoughts going for minds that

1184
00:58:30,850 --> 00:58:28,520
are creating our reality and if we're

1185
00:58:34,300 --> 00:58:30,860
really unhappy with our reality or parts

1186
00:58:37,090 --> 00:58:34,310
of it and we're not able to go deep

1187
00:58:39,430 --> 00:58:37,100
enough to where all of this originated

1188
00:58:41,170 --> 00:58:39,440
which is in the subconscious and then

1189
00:58:42,190 --> 00:58:41,180
even further deep in the collective

1190
00:58:44,350 --> 00:58:42,200
unconscious

1191
00:58:46,690 --> 00:58:44,360
we're never gonna it's like putting a

1192
00:58:48,420 --> 00:58:46,700
bandaid on again a gaping wound we're

1193
00:58:53,350 --> 00:58:48,430
never gonna really be able to heal or

1194
00:58:55,360 --> 00:58:53,360
change so for me it was really I went

1195
00:58:59,050 --> 00:58:55,370
through a couple of classes there were

1196
00:59:01,840 --> 00:58:59,060
actually six month long classes there

1197
00:59:03,700 --> 00:59:01,850
was a women's workshop where we really

1198
00:59:06,670 --> 00:59:03,710
looked at this kind of thing and you've

1199
00:59:08,470 --> 00:59:06,680
got it out on the table and you you know

1200
00:59:09,930 --> 00:59:08,480
a lot of writing and journaling and a

1201
00:59:13,090 --> 00:59:09,940
lot of really

1202
00:59:16,240 --> 00:59:13,100
examining where did my beliefs come from

1203
00:59:18,940 --> 00:59:16,250
why do I keep having the same patterns

1204
00:59:20,950 --> 00:59:18,950
can i trace far as you know as far back

1205
00:59:23,470 --> 00:59:20,960
as I possibly can to wear this pattern

1206
00:59:26,620 --> 00:59:23,480
might have begun and when you do that

1207
00:59:28,090 --> 00:59:26,630
you find out that yes you can and that's

1208
00:59:31,030 --> 00:59:28,100
where you start to say where you've

1209
00:59:34,420 --> 00:59:31,040
given your power away all along the

1210
00:59:37,300 --> 00:59:34,430
course of your life and so if you go

1211
00:59:38,890 --> 00:59:37,310
around oh and and a lot of times the

1212
00:59:41,320 --> 00:59:38,900
clues come from what you complain about

1213
00:59:44,140 --> 00:59:41,330
the most okay so say you're someone who

1214
00:59:45,490 --> 00:59:44,150
complains all the time about I'm really

1215
00:59:47,710 --> 00:59:45,500
sick and tired of people taking

1216
00:59:50,200 --> 00:59:47,720
advantage of me oh my god I'm so tired

1217
00:59:51,310 --> 00:59:50,210
some ticket manager me yeah why am I

1218
00:59:54,550 --> 00:59:51,320
always taking for granted

1219
00:59:55,690 --> 00:59:54,560
bla bla bla those are clues that you are

1220
00:59:58,480 --> 00:59:55,700
playing the victim

1221
01:00:00,370 --> 00:59:58,490
the big V okay that's your archetype

1222
01:00:03,130 --> 01:00:00,380
it's not your only one you've got more

1223
01:00:05,800 --> 01:00:03,140
but that's your big one if you're always

1224
01:00:07,900 --> 01:00:05,810
going around and time says second I'm so

1225
01:00:11,440 --> 01:00:07,910
sick and I so so second I'm so weak

1226
01:00:21,850 --> 01:00:11,450
you're archetype is the the weaklings

1227
01:00:24,520 --> 01:00:21,860
you know you can kind of see right what

1228
01:00:28,120 --> 01:00:24,530
about okay this is what I've noticed in

1229
01:00:32,470 --> 01:00:28,130
myself you know at some point I started

1230
01:00:35,470 --> 01:00:32,480
realizing this having this tiny pin

1231
01:00:40,110 --> 01:00:35,480
light of self-awareness that when

1232
01:00:43,060 --> 01:00:40,120
someone annoys me with a behavior and

1233
01:00:44,740 --> 01:00:43,070
I'm feeling like oh they're so stupid

1234
01:00:47,230 --> 01:00:44,750
they don't know what they're doing and

1235
01:00:49,840 --> 01:00:47,240
why do they do this and that if I really

1236
01:00:52,780 --> 01:00:49,850
look at it there's something in what

1237
01:00:54,900 --> 01:00:52,790
they're doing that I don't like about

1238
01:00:58,300 --> 01:00:54,910
myself

1239
01:01:02,040 --> 01:00:58,310
absolutely absolutely it's a people are

1240
01:01:05,440 --> 01:01:02,050
mirrors they're mirrors for our own

1241
01:01:09,630 --> 01:01:05,450
behaviors and and BS yes that's that

1242
01:01:12,220 --> 01:01:09,640
weird it's like all right to work that

1243
01:01:13,810 --> 01:01:12,230
right yeah and I'll just think oh you

1244
01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:13,820
know how can they do this and do that

1245
01:01:16,180 --> 01:01:15,770
and be that stupid or this that and the

1246
01:01:18,760 --> 01:01:16,190
other MA

1247
01:01:20,050 --> 01:01:18,770
I don't say yeah loud might you because

1248
01:01:22,090 --> 01:01:20,060
I wouldn't want anyone else to know what

1249
01:01:23,410 --> 01:01:22,100
a bad no but it's gone through your head

1250
01:01:25,990 --> 01:01:23,420
you know and the thing is

1251
01:01:27,690 --> 01:01:26,000
we're not aware of 90% if not more of

1252
01:01:30,279 --> 01:01:27,700
the thoughts that go through our head

1253
01:01:33,190 --> 01:01:30,289
and when you become aware what you think

1254
01:01:34,809 --> 01:01:33,200
about you might be in shock about oh wow

1255
01:01:36,759 --> 01:01:34,819
I think about a lot of really negative

1256
01:01:38,650 --> 01:01:36,769
stuff and I really beat the crap out of

1257
01:01:41,440 --> 01:01:38,660
myself and put myself down and call

1258
01:01:43,990 --> 01:01:41,450
myself stupid ugly unattractive a

1259
01:01:48,339 --> 01:01:44,000
failure you know it's like wow

1260
01:01:50,440 --> 01:01:48,349
no wonder my life is but you know so

1261
01:01:53,200 --> 01:01:50,450
easy take us an example though somebody

1262
01:01:56,170 --> 01:01:53,210
let's say it's a woman who care takes

1263
01:01:57,609 --> 01:01:56,180
too much so she's constantly taking care

1264
01:02:00,279 --> 01:01:57,619
of her husband maybe he's an alcoholic

1265
01:02:02,799 --> 01:02:00,289
however she's taken care of her elderly

1266
01:02:06,309 --> 01:02:02,809
parents she's raising six kids

1267
01:02:07,420 --> 01:02:06,319
she's on the PTA board and she's I know

1268
01:02:10,240 --> 01:02:07,430
volunteer

1269
01:02:12,279 --> 01:02:10,250
she's a martyr okay that's her archetype

1270
01:02:14,349 --> 01:02:12,289
she is a murderer and even though she's

1271
01:02:17,589 --> 01:02:14,359
saying all that with love it's building

1272
01:02:19,120 --> 01:02:17,599
incredible resentment in her and it's

1273
01:02:22,299 --> 01:02:19,130
also making her physically and mentally

1274
01:02:23,950 --> 01:02:22,309
fit so until she can listen say oh my

1275
01:02:26,680 --> 01:02:23,960
god I don't want to be a murderer I want

1276
01:02:29,349 --> 01:02:26,690
to be you know I want to take back some

1277
01:02:31,779 --> 01:02:29,359
of my power I want to be a nurturer

1278
01:02:35,460 --> 01:02:31,789
certainly but I want to be more of a

1279
01:02:39,819 --> 01:02:35,470
goddess I want to be more of a you know

1280
01:02:44,589 --> 01:02:39,829
whatever until you until you admit that

1281
01:02:47,859 --> 01:02:44,599
you are something you can't change it or

1282
01:02:51,579 --> 01:02:47,869
fix it or replace it or or tweak it so

1283
01:02:54,819 --> 01:02:51,589
that it's a little more positive admit

1284
01:02:56,170 --> 01:02:54,829
it first that's right like dr. Phil says

1285
01:02:59,200 --> 01:02:56,180
you can't change what you don't

1286
01:03:01,660 --> 01:02:59,210
acknowledge yes and that's the big thing

1287
01:03:04,720 --> 01:03:01,670
about archetypes when you go to the

1288
01:03:06,400 --> 01:03:04,730
movies like everybody loves the new

1289
01:03:10,630 --> 01:03:06,410
Wonder Woman I haven't seen it yet but

1290
01:03:12,970 --> 01:03:10,640
everybody I wanted it's not you know

1291
01:03:16,359 --> 01:03:12,980
yeah from what I hear it's a great movie

1292
01:03:19,349 --> 01:03:16,369
but it's also a universal archetype that

1293
01:03:23,910 --> 01:03:19,359
we have not seen all the lot before a

1294
01:03:26,259 --> 01:03:23,920
powerful loving nurturing woman warrior

1295
01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:26,269
everybody watches games Game of Thrones

1296
01:03:31,509 --> 01:03:28,970
everybody watching Walking Dead Breaking

1297
01:03:34,749 --> 01:03:31,519
Bad I actually in the book look at some

1298
01:03:36,230 --> 01:03:34,759
of the really popular movies and TV

1299
01:03:38,690 --> 01:03:36,240
series and

1300
01:03:39,650 --> 01:03:38,700
even things that sound silly like the

1301
01:03:45,380 --> 01:03:39,660
Brady Bunch

1302
01:03:47,600 --> 01:03:45,390
successful there was some cheesy and yet

1303
01:03:50,150 --> 01:03:47,610
each one of those characters represented

1304
01:03:53,150 --> 01:03:50,160
two different archetypes you had you

1305
01:03:55,700 --> 01:03:53,160
know Cindy the innocent young one and

1306
01:03:59,090 --> 01:03:55,710
then you had jam the misunderstood

1307
01:04:01,730 --> 01:03:59,100
middle child and Marcia was considered

1308
01:04:04,520 --> 01:04:01,740
you know older and then Alice was the

1309
01:04:06,890 --> 01:04:04,530
the martyr I mean you know and it's just

1310
01:04:09,800 --> 01:04:06,900
kind of funny you go look at Gilligan's

1311
01:04:12,470 --> 01:04:09,810
Island you look at newer shows you look

1312
01:04:15,950 --> 01:04:12,480
at new movies I went through the Walking

1313
01:04:18,800 --> 01:04:15,960
Dead and I identified oh my god this is

1314
01:04:19,760 --> 01:04:18,810
why I love the show so much Rick is the

1315
01:04:23,360 --> 01:04:19,770
antihero

1316
01:04:27,370 --> 01:04:23,370
you know and and Carol is the warrior

1317
01:04:29,960 --> 01:04:27,380
and and you start to really see how

1318
01:04:34,120 --> 01:04:29,970
archetypes have been such a big part of

1319
01:04:44,740 --> 01:04:34,130
our lives through stories for movies and

1320
01:04:50,150 --> 01:04:48,950
yes yes okay yep I'm still here I was

1321
01:04:51,770 --> 01:04:50,160
having a little bit of trouble hearing

1322
01:04:54,530 --> 01:04:51,780
you for a moment but I think it's all

1323
01:04:57,710 --> 01:04:54,540
cleared up now now before we get too far

1324
01:05:00,080 --> 01:04:57,720
gone here because we've got about Oh 18

1325
01:05:02,570 --> 01:05:00,090
minutes left I guess in the show I want

1326
01:05:05,840 --> 01:05:02,580
to know how do we get your books I'm

1327
01:05:07,310 --> 01:05:05,850
sure we can go to Amazon but also we

1328
01:05:11,060 --> 01:05:07,320
should go to your website is that Marie

1329
01:05:11,600 --> 01:05:11,070
de Jong's comm Marie Jones comm is my

1330
01:05:13,910 --> 01:05:11,610
website

1331
01:05:16,430 --> 01:05:13,920
the architect book should be in

1332
01:05:20,510 --> 01:05:16,440
bookstores I think it's online it's

1333
01:05:23,750 --> 01:05:20,520
available online already my belief is

1334
01:05:25,790 --> 01:05:23,760
that it hits bookstores next week I like

1335
01:05:26,780 --> 01:05:25,800
I know who knows could already be yeah

1336
01:05:29,870 --> 01:05:26,790
so it should be out soon

1337
01:05:31,370 --> 01:05:29,880
and a mind Wars is already online and in

1338
01:05:33,410 --> 01:05:31,380
bookstores that's been out for a little

1339
01:05:36,980 --> 01:05:33,420
over a year and then I have a new book

1340
01:05:38,900 --> 01:05:36,990
coming out in November or September and

1341
01:05:41,390 --> 01:05:38,910
sorry about one of the biggest

1342
01:05:44,650 --> 01:05:41,400
archetypes of all it's the history of

1343
01:05:48,560 --> 01:05:44,660
demons the devil and fallen angels and

1344
01:05:49,570 --> 01:05:48,570
boy talk about universal symbols wow

1345
01:05:52,450 --> 01:05:49,580
that's

1346
01:05:53,830 --> 01:05:52,460
big one so that would be out so people

1347
01:05:56,230 --> 01:05:53,840
can go to their normal brick-and-mortar

1348
01:05:58,510 --> 01:05:56,240
bookstores if they don't have low order

1349
01:06:05,020 --> 01:05:58,520
it you know it doesn't cost you anything

1350
01:06:08,140 --> 01:06:05,030
or buy them online either way great

1351
01:06:11,320 --> 01:06:08,150
great now the demon book do you have a

1352
01:06:13,870 --> 01:06:11,330
title for it yet it's I believe it's

1353
01:06:17,800 --> 01:06:13,880
called demons the devil and fallen

1354
01:06:19,960 --> 01:06:17,810
angels and a digital Express which is a

1355
01:06:23,580 --> 01:06:19,970
new publisher that I'm working with and

1356
01:06:29,410 --> 01:06:23,590
they're really awesome and they do these

1357
01:06:31,810 --> 01:06:29,420
gigantic almost encyclopedic books so

1358
01:06:34,650 --> 01:06:31,820
that book is going to have just about

1359
01:06:39,190 --> 01:06:34,660
everything you could possibly imagine

1360
01:06:42,970 --> 01:06:39,200
having to do literally I document the

1361
01:06:44,620 --> 01:06:42,980
history of evil demons the devil fallen

1362
01:06:47,230 --> 01:06:44,630
angels not just you know the way we

1363
01:06:51,550 --> 01:06:47,240
think about them in modern times but in

1364
01:06:53,500 --> 01:06:51,560
a concept how did they evolve as ideas

1365
01:06:57,460 --> 01:06:53,510
the idea of evil where that come from

1366
01:06:59,440 --> 01:06:57,470
and the devil and Satan and Lucifer and

1367
01:07:01,840 --> 01:06:59,450
how they're the same and yet they're all

1368
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:01,850
different and just all kinds of stuff it

1369
01:07:09,130 --> 01:07:05,450
really is encyclopedic oh that's really

1370
01:07:12,490 --> 01:07:09,140
a star cover you cover are you gonna

1371
01:07:16,870 --> 01:07:12,500
cover things like Asmodeus and King

1372
01:07:20,440 --> 01:07:16,880
Solomon and everything oh it's gonna be

1373
01:07:23,440 --> 01:07:20,450
good IKEA and what was really

1374
01:07:27,010 --> 01:07:23,450
fascinating yeah I mean you know it goes

1375
01:07:28,990 --> 01:07:27,020
from the origin of evil and how it was a

1376
01:07:32,050 --> 01:07:29,000
necessity of you know our belief in

1377
01:07:34,450 --> 01:07:32,060
duality is as primitive people when we

1378
01:07:36,790 --> 01:07:34,460
looked at nature we began to categorize

1379
01:07:40,900 --> 01:07:36,800
things that happen and oh that's good

1380
01:07:43,750 --> 01:07:40,910
that benefits me and oh lightning storm

1381
01:07:46,570 --> 01:07:43,760
you know earthquakes that bad that's yes

1382
01:07:51,220 --> 01:07:46,580
that's how really how evil and then we

1383
01:07:53,920 --> 01:07:51,230
then we applied Dandy's to those ideas

1384
01:07:56,500 --> 01:07:53,930
and just you know trace the whole origin

1385
01:07:59,290 --> 01:07:56,510
of these concepts right up to modern

1386
01:08:03,100 --> 01:07:59,300
times you know the book goes through the

1387
01:08:03,370 --> 01:08:03,110
satanic panic and modern Dayton ISM it

1388
01:08:05,529 --> 01:08:03,380
goes

1389
01:08:08,529 --> 01:08:05,539
back to the Inquisition and the witch

1390
01:08:11,640 --> 01:08:08,539
burnings and how the you know the

1391
01:08:15,160 --> 01:08:11,650
Catholic Church was involved in shaping

1392
01:08:19,570 --> 01:08:15,170
our perceptions of Satan and demons and

1393
01:08:21,970 --> 01:08:19,580
it goes through Jen and oh really how

1394
01:08:24,610 --> 01:08:21,980
aliens and demons have possibly been

1395
01:08:26,620 --> 01:08:24,620
interchanged and are just literally

1396
01:08:29,649 --> 01:08:26,630
every single thing you could think of if

1397
01:08:34,360 --> 01:08:29,659
I left anything out of that book I will

1398
01:08:36,669 --> 01:08:34,370
be surprised yeah I wonder I did wonder

1399
01:08:40,149 --> 01:08:36,679
about that because you do hear you know

1400
01:08:44,200 --> 01:08:40,159
some people you know have the idea that

1401
01:08:47,979 --> 01:08:44,210
you know ETS or demons and any talk

1402
01:08:53,129 --> 01:08:47,989
about UFOs and aliens is flirting with a

1403
01:08:57,340 --> 01:08:53,139
devil well then and is it possible that

1404
01:09:01,629 --> 01:08:57,350
you know two thousand years ago somebody

1405
01:09:04,090 --> 01:09:01,639
saw a UFO or even an alien you know a

1406
01:09:06,329 --> 01:09:04,100
gray or whatever the kind of aliens that

1407
01:09:09,820 --> 01:09:06,339
were used to hearing about and miss

1408
01:09:12,249 --> 01:09:09,830
identified it as a demon because their

1409
01:09:15,099 --> 01:09:12,259
religious belief you know where that

1410
01:09:17,200 --> 01:09:15,109
anything that didn't come from here came

1411
01:09:18,939 --> 01:09:17,210
from Hell and it's just really

1412
01:09:24,129 --> 01:09:18,949
interesting to see how a lot of these

1413
01:09:25,899 --> 01:09:24,139
ideas sort of come into play and you

1414
01:09:28,689 --> 01:09:25,909
know I talked about I have interviews

1415
01:09:31,689 --> 01:09:28,699
with demonologists and talk about

1416
01:09:33,220 --> 01:09:31,699
possession and exorcism it was a really

1417
01:09:36,280 --> 01:09:33,230
fascinating book to write but it's so

1418
01:09:39,729 --> 01:09:36,290
funny because when I began writing it I

1419
01:09:41,939 --> 01:09:39,739
got a lot of warnings from my friends

1420
01:09:44,530 --> 01:09:41,949
and colleagues in the paranormal field

1421
01:09:47,620 --> 01:09:44,540
you know it should be careful that when

1422
01:09:50,829 --> 01:09:47,630
you open this door you know that my god

1423
01:09:52,930 --> 01:09:50,839
happen well nothing bad happened except

1424
01:09:55,750 --> 01:09:52,940
for computer issues which I have you

1425
01:09:58,090 --> 01:09:55,760
know all the time anyway but I really

1426
01:09:59,709 --> 01:09:58,100
did you know and I wrote it and it was

1427
01:10:01,570 --> 01:09:59,719
written objectively the book is written

1428
01:10:04,570 --> 01:10:01,580
very objectively it's really meant to

1429
01:10:07,450 --> 01:10:04,580
convey information more so than personal

1430
01:10:11,140 --> 01:10:07,460
opinion but I did kind of start looking

1431
01:10:13,330 --> 01:10:11,150
around and looking over my shoulder you

1432
01:10:14,979 --> 01:10:13,340
know do I want to try to not do I want

1433
01:10:17,010 --> 01:10:14,989
to try to get out of this deal maybe I

1434
01:10:20,920 --> 01:10:17,020
should ask my agent if

1435
01:10:22,690 --> 01:10:20,930
but I powered through and nothing bad

1436
01:10:26,850 --> 01:10:22,700
happens and it was absolutely

1437
01:10:30,250 --> 01:10:26,860
fascinating to learn about the different

1438
01:10:36,640 --> 01:10:30,260
beliefs all over the world and how they

1439
01:10:40,450 --> 01:10:36,650
involved certain cultures and religions

1440
01:10:44,380 --> 01:10:40,460
don't believe in Satan or hell that was

1441
01:10:47,260 --> 01:10:44,390
a concentration and I I don't really if

1442
01:10:49,480 --> 01:10:47,270
I'm mistaken I do apologize to all my

1443
01:10:52,000 --> 01:10:49,490
Jewish friends and listeners but I do

1444
01:10:54,670 --> 01:10:52,010
believe that in the Jewish faith they

1445
01:10:57,340 --> 01:10:54,680
don't have the concept of you know you

1446
01:11:12,190 --> 01:10:57,350
send you to go to hell you know and they

1447
01:11:14,920 --> 01:11:12,200
don't demon bull personifications you

1448
01:11:20,950 --> 01:11:14,930
could say but those are you know those

1449
01:11:22,750 --> 01:11:20,960
are evolved around own responsibility

1450
01:11:26,770 --> 01:11:22,760
and paying the consequences for your

1451
01:11:30,580 --> 01:11:26,780
actions you know and in Buddhism we know

1452
01:11:33,910 --> 01:11:30,590
that that you pay karmic debt karmic

1453
01:11:35,830 --> 01:11:33,920
consequences and the only way you ever

1454
01:11:39,100 --> 01:11:35,840
get off the wheel of karma is when you

1455
01:11:40,530 --> 01:11:39,110
are free from having to do that so yeah

1456
01:11:44,440 --> 01:11:40,540
there's all these different

1457
01:11:46,870 --> 01:11:44,450
personifications fascinating because

1458
01:11:50,820 --> 01:11:46,880
they're really wonderful evidence out

1459
01:11:55,140 --> 01:11:50,830
there that the whole concept came from

1460
01:11:59,050 --> 01:11:55,150
our you know our ancestors venus the

1461
01:12:01,330 --> 01:11:59,060
bright shining morning star and hell

1462
01:12:04,120 --> 01:12:01,340
lucifer is actually referred to in the

1463
01:12:07,210 --> 01:12:04,130
Bible a couple of times and as the

1464
01:12:09,280 --> 01:12:07,220
morning star it's really interesting

1465
01:12:12,730 --> 01:12:09,290
stuff that I had never been exposed to

1466
01:12:15,490 --> 01:12:12,740
very much I think for anybody who thinks

1467
01:12:16,510 --> 01:12:15,500
they know about the subject matter I

1468
01:12:18,550 --> 01:12:16,520
think they're gonna be blown away

1469
01:12:21,790 --> 01:12:18,560
they're gonna learn something I just did

1470
01:12:25,930 --> 01:12:21,800
right then because I I did not know ya

1471
01:12:27,640 --> 01:12:25,940
really dig it it's amazing when you are

1472
01:12:29,650 --> 01:12:27,650
forced because of writing a book and you

1473
01:12:30,490 --> 01:12:29,660
have to research and you're forced to

1474
01:12:33,490 --> 01:12:30,500
really dig

1475
01:12:36,190 --> 01:12:33,500
to find you know where did all this

1476
01:12:40,660 --> 01:12:36,200
stuff begin and and I oh and I love the

1477
01:12:42,340 --> 01:12:40,670
history of words had a technology oh yes

1478
01:12:44,800 --> 01:12:42,350
a feature yes

1479
01:12:48,100 --> 01:12:44,810
because you can learn so much about

1480
01:12:51,960 --> 01:12:48,110
something by tracing the history of the

1481
01:12:55,270 --> 01:12:51,970
word itself going back to the room yeah

1482
01:12:56,620 --> 01:12:55,280
came from the old English whatever oh

1483
01:12:59,770 --> 01:12:56,630
wow

1484
01:13:02,880 --> 01:12:59,780
okay that's unusual and it I love that

1485
01:13:08,320 --> 01:13:02,890
it's just I always try to include that

1486
01:13:11,290 --> 01:13:08,330
yes I've started really getting into the

1487
01:13:14,700 --> 01:13:11,300
power of words and also about how we say

1488
01:13:17,350 --> 01:13:14,710
words but we don't really we say them

1489
01:13:19,090 --> 01:13:17,360
because you know it's a shorthand for

1490
01:13:21,190 --> 01:13:19,100
getting our point across but we don't

1491
01:13:23,470 --> 01:13:21,200
really think about the words and what

1492
01:13:27,330 --> 01:13:23,480
the origin was and what they really

1493
01:13:32,890 --> 01:13:27,340
really mean it's it's very interesting

1494
01:13:36,520 --> 01:13:32,900
yeah well and what's really interesting

1495
01:13:38,980 --> 01:13:36,530
too is that you know so much as before

1496
01:13:41,950 --> 01:13:38,990
the written and and spoken language

1497
01:13:44,920 --> 01:13:41,960
ruiny became sophisticated we really

1498
01:13:48,310 --> 01:13:44,930
communicated in symbols and drawings and

1499
01:13:51,010 --> 01:13:48,320
images so a lot of that goes back to the

1500
01:13:53,740 --> 01:13:51,020
archetypal images that we no matter what

1501
01:13:55,450 --> 01:13:53,750
tribe you came from you know or no

1502
01:13:59,080 --> 01:13:55,460
matter where in the world you were

1503
01:14:03,160 --> 01:13:59,090
wandering around you understood what

1504
01:14:06,310 --> 01:14:03,170
that meant yes and how even today we

1505
01:14:08,170 --> 01:14:06,320
have those subtleties in our language we

1506
01:14:12,220 --> 01:14:08,180
have things that are we have subtext

1507
01:14:15,570 --> 01:14:12,230
things that are understood on a a more

1508
01:14:20,680 --> 01:14:15,580
subtle level and it's just you know I

1509
01:14:23,590 --> 01:14:20,690
mean it's not like blaming religion but

1510
01:14:26,950 --> 01:14:23,600
when you look at the devil and and the

1511
01:14:29,620 --> 01:14:26,960
idea of Satan and demons from a

1512
01:14:33,460 --> 01:14:29,630
historical aspect and you really try to

1513
01:14:38,250 --> 01:14:33,470
trace it back to the origin you really

1514
01:14:42,640 --> 01:14:38,260
get to see firsthand the influence that

1515
01:14:43,240 --> 01:14:42,650
religion had on taking ideas and making

1516
01:14:45,850 --> 01:14:43,250
them

1517
01:14:48,640 --> 01:14:45,860
their own for their own purposes now I'm

1518
01:14:51,730 --> 01:14:48,650
not saying they did that for sinister

1519
01:14:54,610 --> 01:14:51,740
purposes you know I believe that the

1520
01:14:57,490 --> 01:14:54,620
Catholic Church felt the need to keep

1521
01:15:01,210 --> 01:14:57,500
its people under control by bringing

1522
01:15:03,190 --> 01:15:01,220
into their belief system the idea that

1523
01:15:04,060 --> 01:15:03,200
if you do something bad you're gonna go

1524
01:15:06,370 --> 01:15:04,070
to hell

1525
01:15:10,710 --> 01:15:06,380
and say we'll be there and he's not very

1526
01:15:14,440 --> 01:15:10,720
nice yes I remember did being told that

1527
01:15:16,990 --> 01:15:14,450
so they didn't hijack some of the the

1528
01:15:20,140 --> 01:15:17,000
beliefs the concepts as they were

1529
01:15:22,150 --> 01:15:20,150
evolving and made them their own for

1530
01:15:26,020 --> 01:15:22,160
their own benefit just as every other

1531
01:15:29,200 --> 01:15:26,030
religion did you know and that led to

1532
01:15:31,510 --> 01:15:29,210
the especially lien and witch burnings

1533
01:15:33,910 --> 01:15:31,520
and you know and unfortunately they're

1534
01:15:36,030 --> 01:15:33,920
still persecution today another really

1535
01:15:39,100 --> 01:15:36,040
fascinating thing I learned is how

1536
01:15:41,830 --> 01:15:39,110
Satanism the true Church of Satan and

1537
01:15:44,500 --> 01:15:41,840
you know the temple of set modern

1538
01:15:48,010 --> 01:15:44,510
Satanism is not what people think it is

1539
01:15:50,140 --> 01:15:48,020
and that there are people I've met a lot

1540
01:15:52,570 --> 01:15:50,150
of churches st. members over the course

1541
01:15:55,450 --> 01:15:52,580
of my life since I started writing these

1542
01:15:58,630 --> 01:15:55,460
books interesting right who are almost

1543
01:16:01,180 --> 01:15:58,640
like atheist they're very pro science

1544
01:16:03,460 --> 01:16:01,190
they're they're you know they're they're

1545
01:16:05,470 --> 01:16:03,470
hedonist they don't believe in violence

1546
01:16:07,810 --> 01:16:05,480
they don't kill babies they don't

1547
01:16:10,090 --> 01:16:07,820
sacrifice animals they don't murder rape

1548
01:16:13,000 --> 01:16:10,100
or any of those things they're very much

1549
01:16:15,700 --> 01:16:13,010
into ritual and they embrace the dark

1550
01:16:17,590 --> 01:16:15,710
side and the light and it was really

1551
01:16:19,330 --> 01:16:17,600
interesting because I had you know I had

1552
01:16:21,460 --> 01:16:19,340
those things during their types there

1553
01:16:23,260 --> 01:16:21,470
are cults out there there are satanic

1554
01:16:27,610 --> 01:16:23,270
cults that take it to the extreme but

1555
01:16:32,410 --> 01:16:27,620
they're not following the true doctrines

1556
01:16:34,780 --> 01:16:32,420
that the real faintness do that was

1557
01:16:36,910 --> 01:16:34,790
fascinating to me because I was one of

1558
01:16:37,780 --> 01:16:36,920
those people that thought they were baby

1559
01:16:41,440 --> 01:16:37,790
killings

1560
01:16:43,000 --> 01:16:41,450
you know dog or cat eating you know and

1561
01:16:46,330 --> 01:16:43,010
that was really fascinating to find out

1562
01:16:49,420 --> 01:16:46,340
that those are those are the extreme nut

1563
01:16:54,120 --> 01:16:49,430
nut jobs yeah I guess there's a whole

1564
01:16:55,860 --> 01:16:54,130
esoteric study or involvement in

1565
01:16:58,080 --> 01:16:55,870
luciferianism yeah

1566
01:17:00,840 --> 01:16:58,090
which I think these a lot of different

1567
01:17:03,210 --> 01:17:00,850
movie stars were involved in it - yes

1568
01:17:03,780 --> 01:17:03,220
and because they wanted to study the

1569
01:17:05,430 --> 01:17:03,790
occult

1570
01:17:08,730 --> 01:17:05,440
they wanted to understand the shadow

1571
01:17:12,210 --> 01:17:08,740
that are the you know the darker aspects

1572
01:17:16,110 --> 01:17:12,220
of reality and and you could say that

1573
01:17:18,390 --> 01:17:16,120
it's more self-centered definitely

1574
01:17:20,280 --> 01:17:18,400
hedonistic but but that was fascinating

1575
01:17:24,300 --> 01:17:20,290
and I'm sure I'm going to get a lot of

1576
01:17:26,010 --> 01:17:24,310
flack for that but I'm sure my job as

1577
01:17:31,530 --> 01:17:26,020
the writers to present the information

1578
01:17:34,710 --> 01:17:31,540
as it is and and not cater to anybody's

1579
01:17:37,080 --> 01:17:34,720
particular beliefs so and I and I think

1580
01:17:41,010 --> 01:17:37,090
this book includes every there's a

1581
01:17:42,750 --> 01:17:41,020
amazingly shocking piece about a guy

1582
01:17:45,270 --> 01:17:42,760
that I know he's been in touch with me

1583
01:17:48,510 --> 01:17:45,280
for a couple of years who is claims to

1584
01:17:52,170 --> 01:17:48,520
be a survivor of satanic ritual abuse

1585
01:17:54,180 --> 01:17:52,180
and I could give sa in there

1586
01:17:57,560 --> 01:17:54,190
because I wanted to show both sides of

1587
01:18:00,990 --> 01:17:57,570
the coin and it's MKULTRA it is very

1588
01:18:02,730 --> 01:18:01,000
scary stuff I can't prove any of it

1589
01:18:04,760 --> 01:18:02,740
either way but I thought you know this

1590
01:18:10,290 --> 01:18:04,770
is important these people are out there

1591
01:18:12,630 --> 01:18:10,300
making these claims and you know this

1592
01:18:15,960 --> 01:18:12,640
needs to be shown this needs to be seen

1593
01:18:18,750 --> 01:18:15,970
as part of the dialogue so it couldn't

1594
01:18:20,520 --> 01:18:18,760
be an interesting book oh gosh it sounds

1595
01:18:23,670 --> 01:18:20,530
like it now you mentioned that a lot of

1596
01:18:25,740 --> 01:18:23,680
you know Hollywood stars were involved

1597
01:18:28,380 --> 01:18:25,750
in I know there were people that were

1598
01:18:36,060 --> 01:18:28,390
involved in you know an Tama BAE's

1599
01:18:39,030 --> 01:18:36,070
Church of say yeah yeah back in the day

1600
01:18:41,910 --> 01:18:39,040
but you know you know I don't know about

1601
01:18:44,100 --> 01:18:41,920
the luciferianism side of I don't know

1602
01:18:46,440 --> 01:18:44,110
if that's the same thing but in your

1603
01:18:48,330 --> 01:18:46,450
book that's coming up are you going to

1604
01:18:50,820 --> 01:18:48,340
talk about any of those people and in

1605
01:18:57,330 --> 01:18:50,830
sharing any of those stories or are you

1606
01:19:01,190 --> 01:18:57,340
not naming and a lot of them are you

1607
01:19:06,570 --> 01:19:05,310
I mean the one that comes to my mind is

1608
01:19:10,330 --> 01:19:06,580
Jane Mansfield

1609
01:19:13,570 --> 01:19:10,340
that yes yes

1610
01:19:16,150 --> 01:19:13,580
yeah and oh gosh now I'm like drawing a

1611
01:19:18,010 --> 01:19:16,160
blank but they're stars of that era and

1612
01:19:20,830 --> 01:19:18,020
the yes leaders you know we're not

1613
01:19:23,590 --> 01:19:20,840
talking about anybody today because and

1614
01:19:26,800 --> 01:19:23,600
those people very well could be but I

1615
01:19:29,290 --> 01:19:26,810
wanted to show how this was a very

1616
01:19:32,200 --> 01:19:29,300
trendy thing you know what that's like

1617
01:19:34,900 --> 01:19:32,210
Aleister Crowley Jimmy Page from Led

1618
01:19:38,230 --> 01:19:34,910
Zeppelin was oh yeah oh no a huge

1619
01:19:41,280 --> 01:19:38,240
follower of his work Jimmy Page was not

1620
01:19:46,420 --> 01:19:41,290
a bad person he was just fascinated with

1621
01:19:51,340 --> 01:19:46,430
with ritual magic and really embraced a

1622
01:19:53,320 --> 01:19:51,350
lot of album covers and whatnot and he

1623
01:19:56,680 --> 01:19:53,330
bought ionely to Crowley's house didn't

1624
01:19:58,540 --> 01:19:56,690
he lived in Allen did yeah yeah oh I

1625
01:20:00,430 --> 01:19:58,550
just thought that was so I was like oh I

1626
01:20:02,860 --> 01:20:00,440
want to go there and you know Aleister

1627
01:20:06,730 --> 01:20:02,870
Crowley was a very interesting person

1628
01:20:09,340 --> 01:20:06,740
area sorcerer very own character so I

1629
01:20:12,910 --> 01:20:09,350
get into him I get into Anton LaVey and

1630
01:20:15,940 --> 01:20:12,920
some of the other characters that that

1631
01:20:18,190 --> 01:20:15,950
sort of set the foundation for Satanism

1632
01:20:19,870 --> 01:20:18,200
the occult you know it and everybody

1633
01:20:22,180 --> 01:20:19,880
groups all that did the same thing but

1634
01:20:25,360 --> 01:20:22,190
really I really wanted to show how each

1635
01:20:27,250 --> 01:20:25,370
thing is so different oh I can't wait to

1636
01:20:29,020 --> 01:20:27,260
for that to come out that's gonna be

1637
01:20:30,430 --> 01:20:29,030
very enlightening I know I'm gonna learn

1638
01:20:32,980 --> 01:20:30,440
some new things since I already learned

1639
01:20:38,050 --> 01:20:32,990
a couple things tonight I imagine I

1640
01:20:41,280 --> 01:20:38,060
figured what else I'm gonna learn if I

1641
01:20:44,260 --> 01:20:41,290
read the whole book but gosh we're

1642
01:20:46,390 --> 01:20:44,270
heading right in to the end of the show

1643
01:20:49,120 --> 01:20:46,400
in fact I believe the music has just

1644
01:20:51,400 --> 01:20:49,130
started rolling so thank you very much

1645
01:20:53,440 --> 01:20:51,410
Marie Dee Jones for joining me tonight

1646
01:20:56,710 --> 01:20:53,450
much much appreciated

1647
01:21:01,420 --> 01:20:56,720
been waiting long back after the devil

1648
01:21:03,100 --> 01:21:01,430
book is out Oh that'll be great thank

1649
01:21:16,900 --> 01:21:03,110
you so much and thanks everyone for